Jump to content

Welcome to the brand new 205GTIDrivers.com website! We hope you'll enjoy it! Read the full notice here.

  • Welcome to 205GTIDrivers.com!

    Hello dear visitor! Feel free to browse but we invite you to register completely free of charge in order to enjoy the full functionality of the website.

Sandy

[race_prep] Our Hillclimb/sprint 205

Recommended Posts

Sandy

Colin Satchell's original 205 competition car became well known as it evolved with Colin's knowledge and machining/fabricating ability and did alot to establish his reputation. It started with a pretty basic shell with a standard Mi16, the engine and chassis developments brought features in CCC up to Retro cars and he took numerous class awards and hill records with it, even an FTD (fastest time of day) at a wet Werrington one year against stiff competition, beating all the single seaters and racing cars!

About 2006 Colin decided that any further development would really need a new base shell and engine, to do what he wanted to do. He sold the car to a customer (it's still in occasional use) and that was that. Since we've been working together, we've had many ideas and ambitions we wanted to invest in another car; initially a 106, which we made some progress with, but the 205 had more ultimate potential for the Modified Production classes and we decided this had to be a car we just built for our own satisfaction, more than anything.

Colin had prepared a 205 shell to near completion for one of our customers, with a Honda H22 engine, but when the customer offered to sell it back to Colin, it seemed the obvious opportunity to quit talking about it and make a start!

 

First stage was to undo all the modifications to the shell for the Honda engine/box. This included a section of bulkhead that had been modified and would need to be put back to original. One of the biggest changes from the old car, would be to mount the engine and box much lower, nearer to vertical, to lower CG, improve the driveshaft angles and enable the subframe to be solid mounted to the engine and use it to carry suspension loads.

Here it is at the mocking up stage, wheel location is vague and the original cage is still in there:

Nov05.jpg

 

With the workload we have, time to spend on this project is limited, so Colin has employed a couple of able friends to do alot of the work, under our supervision. I had a few things I wanted to do differently with the engine, to my previous XU 16 valvers, I toyed with the idea of using the EW head, but in the end I heavily re-worked an XU7J4 head to an entirely new inlet port shape, it took 3 heads to get right and I used the new head on a customer's engine, which produced a fantastically wide torque band, so I was heartened that my efforts were worthwhile! I ported a near copy of that head, but with subtle differences to suit the cams I'll be using in this. A big part of this project is that doing it for our own entertainment, we can go a bit wilder here and there, in a way the responsibility of building for a customer doesn't allow!

The tilted engine would allow the exhaust manifold to be mostly in the engine bay, which helped alot with packaging and where bump steer would dictate the rack needed to be. Normally I farm out exhaust manifolds, but Colin fancied trying his arm at it and based on my dimensions, figured out what bends were needed, acquired them and got on with it. Manifold making is a skill all of its own, knowing how and where to cut and weld, but we're pretty happy with it and once tidied, it'll do the business I'm sure:

Jan12Blog01.jpg

 

Jan12Blog02.jpg

 

Colin was not satisfied with the cage already in the car, so it was cut out and binned. He bought in the main hoop and legs, but fabricated all the other sections in the appropriate tube and with the seating position lowered and moved in slightly for safety (with the confirmed approval of scrutineer), the steering column and general controls could take shape:

Jan12Blog20.jpg

 

Jan12Blog21.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

With the cage gusseted as far as he could before the shell went on the spit, Colin worked on the front subframe/wishbone/upright design to achieve the desired roll centre location, with minimised bump steer, ideal camber/castor and the necessary strength and rigidity. We had to bear in mind too where all the engine ancillaries would be, because space is very limited. Once I'd worked out where the inlet tract would be, the airbox could be made, although it needed some scope for tuning the tract length. That would be done on the engine dyno, but it needed to then fit in the car without anything needing to be re-made or binned. Radiator location is also an issue and we wanted some ducting, to ensure the hot air and cold air stayed apart and went the right way.

 

SBmarch11.jpg

 

SBmarch12.jpg

 

The steering column location needed complete fabrication to suit the new driving position and we decided on retaining the shell of an original dash, because it looks nicer, protects the wiring/electronics and even flocked won't weigh much.

 

SBmarch13.jpg

 

SBmarch14.jpg

 

Colin was very keen to run 9" rims on the front, to get the tyre size/compound he wanted. It takes some accomodating mind and might make for rather heavy steering!

 

AprBl1203.jpg

 

By now most of the parts were finalised and could be removed to be cleaned/blasted and plated/painted or powder coated. The shell went onto the spit, to make access better for the final cage/gusset welding, done mostly by TIGger Dave:

Photo0350.jpg

 

Then the shell was prepped for interior paint. Being a strict competition car and cost being a factor, the paint finish is as good as it needs to be, don't expect concours!

 

AprBl1211.jpg

 

AprBl1212.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

We had a friend of ours make the dry sump tank to fit neatly over the gearbox. The pan we've made ourselves and all the pump mounts etc, to suit the unique location. The Pace kit would mount the pump too low, it wouldn't be safe. The pipes will be as short as possible with the location we've chosen, reducing cost and weight. The dry sump tank was made with breather bottle and coolant header tank, fits like a charm apart from one pipe on the header that clashes with the cross tube and will need to be moved:

June1202.jpg

 

Some of the bits back from powder and plating, front subframe and wishbone components, trailing arms etc:

June1211.jpg

 

Diffuser and floor panels:

June1212.jpg

 

Air box (lighter than it looks!);

June1213.jpg

 

Fabricated pedals:

June1214.jpg

Edited by Sandy
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
harryskid

You two guys are so clever and the standard of work looks great, keep it up guys. Colin those tbs i had off you are just the job, cheers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

Thanks Harry :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alan_M

Very impressive.

 

I've got the Retro Cars magazine with the old car in it somewhere.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Spiky

some very cool bits and peices guys, keep it up :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
chipstick

Outstanding fabrication skills. Will be following this thread closely.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
johnnyboy666

looking forward to reading the rest!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

Thanks chaps :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Spiky

sadly i cant keep watching this topic as it will cost me many more '000's of pounds ...lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Powers

Very good work as expected from Colin et al.

Interesting tubular subframe with pick ups of the cage. Strut top mounts that must clear the bonnet by mm's.

Good to see the weight saving continuing from the old car onto this one. All that powder coating will add up though!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
stefan

Nice! Looking forward to reading more of this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MrG

heard so many things about you guys from many on this forum, but I am incredibly jealous of the work you lot do and the standard you work to. Keep the thread going, need to see more.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kyepan

when can we expect the next update? will it be ready for retro rides on august 19th

awesome by the way!

Edited by kyepan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GLPoomobile

New favourite topic.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
barry d

Looking forward to reading more of this. Outstanding fabrication skills. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Baz

Nothing short of superb as ever, not that we'd expect any less!

 

If the 'Ultimate' moniker had to be put somewhere... :ph34r::lol:

 

Keep the updates coming! :D

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
welshpug

That subframe looks ideal for a V6 conversion, so much clearance!

 

 

Is this the progress up to date?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

It's up to date now. Colin's got one of our pals coming in to get to work on building it up and making the remaining bracketry etc. I'm fulled committed to customer engines right now, but need to make serious progress on this! We hope to test around mid August, there's a local event it would be nice to do near the end of August.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Batfink

I saw a similar subframe on a rally car build a few years back. Always wondered how much weight could be saved. Whats the weight saving there? Nice to see spherical bearings being used :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

It's not the weight so much as being able to vastly improve the front geometry at a lower ride height. The pick up points have moved in all three axis to optimise roll centre location, reduce bump steer, widen the wishbone mounting points and stiffen the whole lot up. The hideous front end behaviour of virtually all high powered 205s, is largely down to the fact that most essentially retain the original pivot points.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
johnnyboy666

If you hadnt already considered it, I'd imagine there's quite a good market for subframes like that...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sandy

Maybe not in this form, the engine re-location is too far reaching, but Colin has produced a great deal of re-worked original subframes already, a tubular one might be possible.

 

Brief update:

 

I had Colin's old 205 down the other day, just for a few checks; looks very old now against the new one!

June1215.jpg

 

Kevin putting in the flocked dash and a few controls:

Jun1216.jpg

 

June1217.jpg

 

Colin trying the seat for size, to finalise the position:

June1218.jpg

 

Seat fitted;

June1219.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EdCherry

Dare I ask how yourself/colin have got around the issue of lift up reverse cables for BE1 (If you've had it of course!)? Im finding my 205 cable to short to do what I want with it....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×