[trackday_prep] Project 150

[RossD 43]

A lightened flywheel is a long long way down my priority list at the moment!

[RossD 43]

Argh!!

 

Can I make this bloody engine fit correctly? Can I F**k!!

 

The picture below illustrates the point.

 

The engine sits too far upright, so much that both engine mounts are being 'bent', as per the picture above. The drivers side top mount is similar. I need it to sit back a few more degrees, but none of the bottom forks I've tried are long enough. (I've tried a TU, XU and an EW one from a Xsara). I need one about 150mm between centres, but as far as I can see one this long doesnt exist.

 

Anyone got any bright ideas?

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

Have you moved the fork to the TU hole on the subframe? There's a thread on here from Biggles who did this.

Edited May 7, 2016 by Alan_M

[RossD 43]

The hole is the same as I've used previously (i.e. the rear most one of the two). The fork wont fit in the other hole as it wont line up with the mount on the engine as they are not in line.

 

Edit: Hmm, once it light tomorrow I'll see if I can move it over to the other hole, but pretty sure it doesnt line up properly.

Edited May 7, 2016 by RossD

[welshpug 1,622]

you need to use a different rear mount to the 206 one, 307 iirc.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

The thread I was talking about.....Sandy Brown top mount, standard gearbox mount, 206GTi bottom mount and the fork moved to the hole further back on the subframe.

 

http://forum.205gtidrivers.com/index.php?showtopic=155494

[RossD 43]

Cheers Alan_m, that's pretty much what I'm trying however with that combination it's just plain wrong. I'm using a 205 gearbox mount as the 206 one is too big.

I can only think that something is amiss with the satchell top mount I've got, which makes the engine sit in the wrong initial position. More investigation needed I think!!

Edited May 8, 2016 by RossD

[RossD 43]

Ok, so a 307 engine mount is a no -go. They won't fit. Nor will a 206 mount as they are the same design as the 307 ones.

 

307 mount:

 

Compare to a 205 / 306 style mount:

 

So it looks like I'll have to extend the current fork by about 25mm to get the engine sitting properly. The trouble is, this then pushes the alternator through the front panel, so that will have to be cut.

[welshpug 1,622]

i meant the bit bolted to the engine.

 

check with DCC, he's got the bits in his garage

Edited May 8, 2016 by welshpug

[RossD 43]

Ahhh, now I understand, cheers Mei.

The GTi180 and GTi mounts do have different part numbers on Servicebox, so I'll see if I get can get hold of a different one.

Edited May 8, 2016 by RossD

[RossD 43]

So I've sorted out the engine mounting issue. I used a bit of logic which turned out to be correct. The late Citroen Xsara's were fitted with the EW10 and they have the same mount 'touch points' as a 205 as far as the top and bottom rear mounts are concerned. I managed to find a mount with the correct part number (1807.J2) on Italian ebay and it arrived yesterday.

It bolts straight up to the engine and after a bit of relieving of the front panel to give the alternator space, the engine is now bolted up and sitting at the correct angle

 

Couple of pictures below showing the difference between the 206 GTi180 and Xsara EW 2.0 mounts. You can see the rubber donut is in a different position on the Xsara one, essentially in line with the driveshaft bearing holder, making the engine tilt back that bit further. Also the Xsara mount has the correct holes for the hockey stick style driveshaft bearing retainers.

 

EW Xsara mount on left, 206 mount on the right.

 

 

The other side... Xsara mount on right, 206 mount on left.

 

 

[welshpug 1,622]

thats the bugger

[dcc 855]

Hey Ross

 

Whatsapp'd you a few photos

 

is that an aluminium mount/bracket?

[RossD 43]

Thanks Dan - Yes it is. As per my message, it weighs 1450g, so would be interesting to see how that compares to the iron 307 HDi mount you've got.

Edited May 14, 2016 by RossD

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

Just looked on Servicebox and the GTi180 mount is a different part number to the GTi138. I'll double check my 138 lump tomorrow. Might explain why Biggles got away with it!

[welshpug 1,622]

his was ew7 based, with xu5 crank thrown into the mix

[RossD 43]

I think the only difference between the 138 and the 180 mount is how it attaches to the block - The 138 mount has 4 bolts an the 180 mount has 3. Certainly from the pictures I've seen of them, they would make the engine sit at an incorrect angle in a 205, as the 180 mount does.

Edited May 14, 2016 by RossD

[RossD 43]

Excuse the quality of the pictures... Just thought I'd show that it fits and now sits at the correct angle. Even has clearance in all the right places!

 

â

 

Next job, getting the new engine loom I made at the end of last year into the passenger compartment where the ECU will reside.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

Looks at home there!

 

What's the deal with shafts?

[RossD 43]

Using the 205 diesel / 1.6 shafts. It had a BE4 gearbox attached to the TU5 engine I had in there previously, so will reuse those shafts.

Edited May 15, 2016 by RossD

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

no lower than an xu I'd imagine, its a shorter block, though I forgot to measure total height.

 

 

I'll measure it later, but there is a funny ridge on the bottom of the sump on an EW that an XU doesnt have, which probably makes it sit lower than an XU in reality, even though it has a shorter block. It does sit below the subframe, but that picture does make it look worse than it is. I'd guess about 10cm clearance? It's on Eibach 7001 springs.

 

I shouldn't be worried....I measured my Mi last night and that only had 80mm clearance (Standard Mi16 on a GTi6 sump on Bilstein Challenge/Eibachs). The EW block is shorter (430mm against 450mm of the Mi), the EW head being 40mm taller.

 

I've just bought an EW10J4S so will be keeping an eye on this project!

[RossD 43]

Yea - the ground clearance isn't something I'm particularly worried about now its mounted properly tbh, it looks high enough.

 

Good progress over the weekend, got the new ECU loom connected up at both ends, and got all of the 12V feeds in the engine bay wired in (I'm relocating the battery to behind the passenger seat), enough that I could power up the ECU and crank the engine over to build oil pressure. (Took a good 10 seconds of cranking to get the dash light to go out, eek!)

 

Firstly, a pic of my shiny new tool to crimp the ends on battery cables. Makes the job a breeze!

 

A shot of the electrics in the engine bay. The red thing is the distribution post for the 12v positive, feeding the starter/alternator and the existing car loom from the old box attached to the slam panel. I still havent installed the battery feed yet. The little black box is the Wideband lambda controller and the 4 relays are part of my new ECU loom.

 

I've also modified the RH engine mount to try and limit side to side engine movement. I should have done this before I installed the engine by drilling and attaching it to the bodywork, but forgot. With the engine in you cant get a drill in to make the hole, so I drilled the engine mount instead.

 

And finally, powering it up via some jump leads..... Nothing went pop or fizz and all the smoke stayed inside the electrics! All the sensors look good and all the relays power up as they should, so I'm confident the electrics are good. The ECU is currently in the passenger footwell until I tidy it all up and relocate it properly.

​

Edited May 31, 2016 by RossD

[calvinhorse 870]

Nice work Ross

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

Where did you get this distribution post from? *wannahave*

 

​

[RossD 43]

Its from car builder solutions. Just down the road from me, so I find myself down there most Saturday mornings buying stuff!

 

http://www.carbuildersolutions.com/uk/red-distribution-post

Edited May 31, 2016 by RossD