Building Bottom Arms With Rose Joints - If We All Chip In Money Saved

[205_sunderland 4]

Hmmmmmm.........NO

 

But he'll sell you a pair of Rose Joints.......or even a pair of arms.

 

 

Ill give him a call and ask about the joints thought thanks

[Bas 6 1 Cars]

My friend Koos has made a couple of these Bottom Arms.

 

 

See the topic on the dutch Peugeot GTi forum:

 

http://www.peugeotgt....php?f=22&t=503

 

The 205 GTi Turbo 16 (350 HP 420 Nm) of Eelko Kleibeuker is racing DNRT with these Bottom Arms.

http://www.ls-racing...-ls-racing.html

 

SO no worries about the strenght.

[Sandy 189]

To answer the question, Colin Satchell's front suspension is around 1200-1500 depending on exact spec. Important to remember that it resolves a number of issues being ignored here... roll centre, bump steer and subframe stiffness. Given his current workload, it's irrelevant as an option; but my point was, that to properly sort the problems with the front end, that's what you'll need to do.

[205_sunderland 4]

My friend Koos has made a couple of these Bottom Arms.

 

 

See the topic on the dutch Peugeot GTi forum:

 

http://www.peugeotgt....php?f=22&t=503

 

The 205 GTi Turbo 16 (350 HP 420 Nm) of Eelko Kleibeuker is racing DNRT with these Bottom Arms.

http://www.ls-racing...-ls-racing.html

 

SO no worries about the strenght.

 

His prices seem alot fairer imo, but not sure what parts hes using, and i see the joints are welded into the arm flat i want to lower my car 30mm so i wonder if he set-up will work ok with that amount of lowering

[Bas 6 1 Cars]

His prices seem alot fairer imo, but not sure what parts hes using, and i see the joints are welded into the arm flat i want to lower my car 30mm so i wonder if he set-up will work ok with that amount of lowering

 

He is using these Rose Joints:

 

http://www.fluro.de/...SW16MSDruck.htm

[lahondal 17]

I`m making adjustable arms and selling it in Spain, only for rallying and trackdays. I race with a pair and no problems yet.

 

Are really cheap and anyone with a little effort can fabricate it easy!

 

Here a pic.

 

 

 

Un saludo.

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

How much

[205_sunderland 4]

He is using these Rose Joints:

 

http://www.fluro.de/...SW16MSDruck.htm

 

brilliant mate, ill get a price on them joints aswell

[205_sunderland 4]

I`m making adjustable arms and selling it in Spain, only for rallying and trackdays. I race with a pair and no problems yet.

 

Are really cheap and anyone with a little effort can fabricate it easy!

 

Here a pic.

 

 

 

Un saludo.

 

 

they look mighty fine bud, well done, water jet cut?

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

What loads are you using in the analysis?

[205_sunderland 4]

My dims, use at your own risk, these suit my application and needs only.

 

Plain shank length 55mm

Thread length 20mm

Thread form M16x2

Head length 4mm

Head dia 24mm with flat to core dia one side

Shank diameter 15.98-16.00mm

Notch dims no info as I will machine in situ.

 

ill get these sizes on a drawing and see how they plan out i suppose i can measure a hub for distance of notch to centre, any ideas on recommended material.

 

so are you saying overall length is 79mm by the way?

 

cheers mick

Edited July 12, 2011 by 205_sunderland

[205_sunderland 4]

can anyone recommend places for getting prices on aurora and fluro joints then? the place ive tried been ages now so going to look elsewhere

[205_sunderland 4]

got some prices today a today and if i use 16x16 fluro like the lads are over the water there £70 a pop and check this out if i use genuine rose , 20x16 joints i cant get them for 100 quid each and he said there the real deals pug sport used so im quite surprised at the price,

 

Im more tempted to use the 16 diameter ones though as he stated long term there could be supply issues with the 20 dia joints thus a massive price tag at later date as they will only be special made for this purpose and the 16's have other applications

[Cameron 16]

I'd be concerned about 16mm rod ends tbh, I was going to use these to make tubular wishbones a while back and on road tyres they're fine, but semi's / slicks could bring them close to failing under braking.. if you trail-braked into a kerbed chicane it's probable you'd bend one.

Edited July 16, 2011 by Cameron

[205_sunderland 4]

Im going to make some calls today about the 16x20's and see whats what with them

[omega 82]

why are they only used for off road raceing and rallying?

if they stong enough for off road they must be good enough for day to day,or an i missing something?

[205_sunderland 4]

Right i spoke with js motorsport today (205wrc's pal) and im quite happy with the off the shelf kit he can do you.

 

The price for the joints (m20x16) and pins is £250 for both sides hell do you the inserts too for £300 so its just a case of weld them in and away you go. The joints he has custom made by a bearing manufacturer and regards them very highly. I prefer this option as long term i hear rose are going to stop making there joints anyway (plus theyve priced themselves out the market now) and as long as his company who makes them stays trading you sorted .

 

Im personally just going to get the kit for £250 and get insert elsewhere as i can get them done for nothing from a friend but without me taking a hand to a machine id like to think ive proved a big saving for road and track application so far.

 

The labor to weld the arm should only cost £50 for a decent fabrication place so if you say got the inserts off mgcgill instead you could build a set for £310 without lifting a finger but ill but hoping to get mine complete for £250 and get a friend in the know to do it for me,which you could do too , the inserts have to except weld so do not need to be made out the same thing as wolferines exoskeleton so will be very cheap to get hold of.......watch this space now i just need some funds

 

p.s i will be providing a lower cost guide for people with machining capabilities on request once the first set is down so if your a dab hand in the workshop or have a friend you could make a set for under £200

 

 

mick

[Cameron 16]

Glad to see you opted for the tried and tested bearings!

[Rippthrough 98]

as long as his company who makes them stays trading you sorted .

 

 

Even if they do I can get joints made, I had all the droplink joints custom-forged

[tri_longer 25]

Wolverine has an endoskeleton not exoskeleton.

[205_sunderland 4]

Wolverine has an endoskeleton not exoskeleton.

 

 

At my old old work me and one of the guys thought it would be funny to order some polymimetic alloy in and some adimantium (what the t1000 terminator is made out of and wolverines endoskeleton)

 

The materials guy came back really dissapointed they didnt stock what we wanted :lol: :lol:

Edited July 16, 2011 by 205_sunderland

[Bas 6 1 Cars]

I'd be concerned about 16mm rod ends tbh, I was going to use these to make tubular wishbones a while back and on road tyres they're fine, but semi's / slicks could bring them close to failing under braking.. if you trail-braked into a kerbed chicane it's probable you'd bend one.

 

As i mentioned before:

 

The 205 GTi Turbo 16 (350 HP 420 Nm) of Eelko Kleibeuker is racing DNRT (Dutch National Racing Team) with these Bottom Arms.

 

If 16mm rod ends can hold 350 HP and 420 Nm (on a Peugeot 205 GTi Turbo 16 that is doing RL (Real Live) races) without any problems I'm sure 16mm is strong enough.

 

Why are you concerned Cameron?

[Cameron 16]

It doesn't matter at all how much power the car is making, you will never be able to exceed the forces seen under braking. You can only put down as much power as the traction you have available from the tyres, and since weight is transferred backwards under acceleration you will have less traction than under braking where weight is being transferred forwards.

 

Basically horsepower has absolutely nothing to do with it! You'd have a stronger argument by telling us what tyres and brakes the car is running!

[lahondal 17]

Hi!

 

About my bottom arms, the test of the pics are done with a 1500kg braking charge.

 

Un saludo.

[Bas 6 1 Cars]

It doesn't matter at all how much power the car is making, you will never be able to exceed the forces seen under braking. You can only put down as much power as the traction you have available from the tyres, and since weight is transferred backwards under acceleration you will have less traction than under braking where weight is being transferred forwards.

 

Basically horsepower has absolutely nothing to do with it! You'd have a stronger argument by telling us what tyres and brakes the car is running!

 

There's a link with the specs of the car in my first post...

 

Everything you'll ever need to know just 1 click away.

 

http://www.ls-racing...-ls-racing.html

 

For people with "click fear" :

 

Auto korte beschrijving:

205 GTi, Bouwjaar: 1993 M0MY

 

Voor ophanging/ vering:

Verlengde draagarmen, Xsara VTS aandrijfassen, 205 ABS Fusee's, 309 16v Stabistang, Extra dikke stabistokjes, Intrax onderstel, Powerflex Zwart bussen, OMP veerpoot en Wiechers draagarmbrug

 

Remmerij voor:

AP Racing 4 Pots met 295x28mm schijven, Carbone Loraine remblokken, Goodridge remslangen

Achter ophanging/ vering:

309GTi 16v achteras met Intrax dempers

 

Achter Remmerij:

1.9 Schijven met Ferodo DS performance blokken, Goodridge remslangen

Kooi:

Sparco FIA 10punt, wordt nog uitgebreid hier en daar.

 

Stoel(en):

Sparco Rev en Sparco Sprint

 

Gordels:

L-Tec 6 Punts gordels

 

Stuur:

Suède Sabelt stuur

 

Motor (340pk, 420nm op 1bar Turbodruk):

T16 met wat aanpassingen:

 

• Wiseco gesmede zuigers
• Pauter gesmede drijfstangen
• Wiseco stalen koppakking
• Garret Turbo GT28RS
• DP Welders nightmare uitlaatspruitstuk
• DP nightmare downpipe 70mm
• VEMS motormanagement
• Mocal Oliekoeler 15 rijen
• Volledige alluminium radiateur
• 605 TD radiateur voor Chargecooler
• Bosch Chargecooler pomp
• Custom made uitlaat 2,5" met Simons midden + einddemper
• QSP Siliconen slangen
• Baker BM motorsteun

Aandrijving/schakelmechanisme:

 

• Xsara VTS versnellingsbak
• Sperdiff
• 206 RC Vliegwiel
• Helix 230mm versterkte drukgroep + Race koppeling geveerd

Velgen/banden:

 

• 15" Ouragan 6,5j met GoodYear Eagle F1
• 15" Ouragan 6,5j met Toyo R888
• 15" Ouragan 6,5j met Toyo RS1 Full Slicks

Overig:

 

• Accubak achterin
• Brandblusser achterin
• VEMS LCD display
• QSP Catch Tank 2liter
• Bosch benzine pomp (Extern)