[engine_work] My 2.0 Turbo Project

[Mikey G 3]

I am astonished by those power figures, you must have a different turbo or have modded that as the peak power is at 6k rpm, the standard engine peaks at about 5k rpm from what I can remember.

 

I take it that is also running some serious boost, must be at least a bar minimum I would have thought for those figures?

 

If it is the standard turbo I am amazed that it can even generate those figures!!

 

If you look at the graph it shows boost peak at around 1 bar, for some reason that day (it was cold) we were getting intermitent boost spikes to nearly 1.2 and the ECU would cut, thats why the operator backed off around 3.5-4krpm.

 

As far as peak power is concerned, there is only 2bhp difference from 5100 rpm up to 6100 rpm so we seemed to have hit a sweet spot as there is not as sharp a boost drop off as expected. It was pushing 225bhp at 5krpm. Turbo is standard.

 

Ideally it needs bigger injectors, better fuel pump (operator noticed a weakness on the dyno) and new management with mappable boost.

[Stu 18]

So other than running a bar of boost its standard?

[Discostu 6]

Other than a re-build it is running standard internals yes.

 

I'm happy with the 167bhp @ the wheels, whether or not the flywheel figure is accurate leaves alot to debate. It was a bitterly cold day (i guess that should be taken into consideration) and i'd played with the boost to try and get the maximum out of it.

 

A breakdown of the mods is simply:

 

Custom exhaust system & downpipe,

Custom air feed intake and air filter,

Custom made front mount intercooler and pipework,

Manual boost controller set to spike at just over 1bar

 

And before everyone tells me how you should'nt run that much boost because it will blow up, i must add i'v been running a bar since i built it back in August/September and have had no reliability issues

Edited November 27, 2007 by Discostu

[craig f90 0]

Nice work. Im impressed at those figures. Well built project, ive been following this for a while now. Its a shame your selling it Mines done now, but its not running a bar. Yet.

anyway well done.

[danpug 1]

It shows theres alot of bull going around the net. I read on here that the standard exhaust manifold cannot run more than 180bhp! How many miles have you drove with it at 1 bar? Do you run an lsd? Superb result, bet it pulls like a train.

[Discostu 6]

Thanks guys, and yes it is pretty nippy

 

I'v probably done about 5k miles in her now, and using it as a weekend/trackday car i wouldn't class them as 'easy' miles. I built it to go fast and thats what it does. And as much as i'd love to have fitted an lsd, money never allowed me to do it

[danpug 1]

Whats traction like then? How does it compare to your previous mi16? I used to have an mi and previously had an mi on bodies, new engine spec is in my sig, hoping it impresses!

[Discostu 6]

In the wet, put simply there is none lol

 

In the dry 1st and 2nd are pretty pointless also, once its in 3rd gear tho you really need to hold on as it just leaps forward, then again in 4th and 5th. As for compared to the mi16:- well although the turbo is much quicker when u point and squirt, i must confess i miss the revvy 16 valves and the smooth power delivery

[danpug 1]

I fancy something that you don't have to rev the tits off for now! What sort of price will you be selling for?

[welshpug 1,621]

I think the lack of grip also has something to do with the tyres stu

 

I'd love it as it looks like my 205 but cleaner and twice as powerfull!

Edited November 27, 2007 by welshpug

[bales 1]

That is pretty impressive then, there does seem to be quite a lot of crap written on this forum about this engine with little or no actual evidence of figures so it is nice to see what a good one can actually get.

 

I have run mine at 1 bar for brief periods but I have tuned mine back down to 0.5 bar now as in all honesty it is not very driveable!

 

In the dry 1st and 2nd are uselesss and in the wet the only gear that is usable is 5th as even in 4th on a light curve or camber it will spin up when i comes on boost.

 

But thats without a LSD but with decent toyo tyres

[tom_m 0]

not that i want to detract from your results, but i must confess i'm surprised the engine achieved 230bhp from the stock injectors, the flow rate figures i found for the them suggests it shouldn't be able to fuel for that much power.

 

you can also see the limitation of the small turbo, with it only actually achieving 14psi between 4200 and 4600 rpm after which its running out of puff.

 

that said its certainly a tidy conversion and its good to know its running well.

Edited November 28, 2007 by tom_m

[danpug 1]

That is pretty impressive then, there does seem to be quite a lot of crap written on this forum about this engine with little or no actual evidence of figures so it is nice to see what a good one can actually get.

 

 

Thats my thoughts exactly.

[bales 1]

I should add to this that I don't actually think those fly figures are achievable in reality but there is no point in getting into a debate about rr's!

 

Though I would guess about the 200bhp @ fly mark is achievable.

[Mikey G 3]

Powerstations rollers are known to be fairly accurate. All the other cars that ran on the day pretty much lived upto their expectations apart from the odd car that was maybe slightly up or down on the day. It would be unusual for just one car to be so far out on the day.

 

As far as fueling goes i did say somewhere else the operator noticed a weakness in the fueling as we asked him to monitor it on this run. I have studied the graph and there seems to be no abnormalities with regards to rpm figures. The fact it made nearly 170bhp at the wheels cannot be denied, and that it was trying its hardest to remove itself from the rollers sugests the torque figures are also very healthy

[TEKNOPUG 3]

Nice conversion.

 

How much did it cost in total for parts and labour?

[bales 1]

Not to want to get into a argument about this - though with these comments I probably will lol!

 

If you look at it from a purely logical manor, the engine (supposedly) makes 150bhp @ 7psi or 0.5 bar - for the sake of argument ignore the fact it might be a bit more without a cat and different exhaust etc....

 

In theory by running at 1 bar you are adding 50% more air (though it will never ever work like that due to losses e.g pressure drop, adiabatic compression etc...) I have looked at the compressor maps for this turbo and at that pressure ratio it is a long way out of its effciency island which means it will be generating a "lot" of extra heat and probably nowhere near an extra 0.5 bar of actual pressure.

 

So even in the absolute perfect situation where pV doesn't equal nRt so you would get no actual losses from increasing the boost then you would still only get 75bhp extra which is 225bhp.

 

I guess that the engine probably makes slightly more than quoted with larger bore exhaust and no cat etc... but even then the injectors are 240cc so unless you run them at a very high pressure then I would doubt there would be enough fuel to make 230ishbhp, I can't remeber the actual equation for that but there is a very basic one that you can do that gives you the max power available from a given flow rate.

 

Admittedly this is all a bit pedantic and I am being argumentative for the sake of it but I just don't think that those power figures are achievable with a standard engine.

 

Though I bet it is still bloody quick as I know from driving mine, but its the torque that makes them feel so fast

[Discostu 6]

Nice conversion.

 

How much did it cost in total for parts and labour?

 

Hmm, i can put a rough figure of about £2k on it. Thats including the engine, the rebuild, ss exhaust system, intercooler, radiator, oil cooler, clutch, flywheel and all the pipes/cables i used.

 

As for being arguementative bales, i really dont mind. So long as its sensible discussion and not bitching, as i'v never quoted any silly power figures. I'm obviously gonna be happy with the result but i too agree it is probably a little high at the flywheel, i'd like to think it could be producing at least 210bhp tho.

 

As for the torque.... yep its just crazy lol

[TEKNOPUG 3]

That's a lot of dough!

Nice results both with conversion and performance all the same.

[Discostu 6]

It can be done alot cheaper. I just wanted the engine fitted in a short timescale and didn't want to cut any corners. Most of the stuff i bought could probably have been sourced second hand if i'd had more time.

 

I guess its paid off tho as i'v never had any trouble with the conversion so far

[danpug 1]

What diameter intercooler pipework did you use?

[TEKNOPUG 3]

It can be done alot cheaper. I just wanted the engine fitted in a short timescale and didn't want to cut any corners. Most of the stuff i bought could probably have been sourced second hand if i'd had more time.

 

I guess its paid off tho as i'v never had any trouble with the conversion so far

 

I'd probably stick with an XU9 and spend the money on a decent manifold, turbo and management if I had that sort of budget - but the end result would have been pretty similar no doubt.

[Sloppy 0]

thtas a really neat job there chief, well done.

 

Old engine really did give up peroperly!!

 

i bet the turbo ones are much better to drive than the mi16, you cant beat turbos for torque!

[S13Nick 0]

i wish i had the room and time to pay as much attention to my conversion as you have to yours, ive had to just try throw mine togethor , really annoying

[Guest Matt205T]

Awesome car there fella, very well done.

 

I've started my conversion and receive the engine this weekend, but can't imagine it been even close to how nicely done yours is.

 

 

Well done, top work.