605 Srti / 205 Gti Conversion

[rex 1]

Cheers Sam - how the hell did you know it was my birthday?? Christ I've got a stinking hang-over...too much Heineken, Aberlour, and Haut Medoc last night followed by that evil eau de vie in the damned coffee...

 

Saxo power steering pump has arrived in the post so I'm nearly there...heh, I've just got to find space to fit it Speak soon,

 

Rex

[sonofsam 5]

Whoa nice mix

 

I know all about you, mwhahhaha , nah .....Comes up who's B'day it is when you come onto the main forum page

Noticed it was yours so thought I would message you

[rex 1]

Hi everyone,

 

Well - after re-locating the battery to the boot and fitting the saxo electric power steering pump in its' place she was finally ready for a blast down the road.....

 

Whilst I know after being spoilt having owned several vehicles that have had 500+ bhp, I must admit to being a bit disappointed. It doesn't seem a lot quicker than a standard 1.9 ?? The compressor stall makes a nice noise through the gear change but you can't really hear the turbo whistling at all...? I realize it will always be a 205 and never a GT2 but I'm sure it isn't as powerful as it should be.

 

...I guess the first port of call is to fit a boost guage and see what the turbo is doing - and whether my "air-box" (patent pending) is the cause of any eventual loss in power. The problem here is that rolling road tuning hardly exists and would involve hundreds of KM's to get it looked at.

 

To all of you out there with a successful conversion I have a question - what kind of comparison would you give the 2.0T compared to other standard road-going cars? I've had a 205 with an Mi16 engine on twin webers and it was a lot faster and a damned sight cheaper to build...

 

For info - the high pressure pipe from a RHD 2000 Renault laguna estate 2.0 petrol fits perfectly where I located the steering pump with a slight bit of heating and careful bending - which I incidently had in stock and the 405 turbo diesel gearbox seems perfectly matched to the engine.

 

Any comments as usual....

 

Regards, Rex

[Ant 2]

Hi Rex,

 

I think your tube box is the first thing to review. I made a similar thing ( not as pretty thow ) and the boost was terrible. I remade mine with a 45degree angle on the corners and it boosts fine and get 1/2 bar no probs.

 

This will mean you have to move your IC forward a bit

 

Making progress thow - wont be long now..

[rex 1]

Hi Ant,

 

Thanks for the reply. I've actually had to weld my "box" to the intercooler so I'll try and bodge something up with another intercooler I have here off a Renault Master (which is as long but a lot thinner) to see if it makes a difference before un-doing hours of work

 

Does the turbo make a noticeble whistle on yours when accelerating hard? I'm still stumped that with an almost straight through exhaust I can hardly hear it...

 

Regards, Rex

[whizzer71 0]

Hi everyone,

 

Well - after re-locating the battery to the boot and fitting the saxo electric power steering pump in its' place she was finally ready for a blast down the road.....

 

Whilst I know after being spoilt having owned several vehicles that have had 500+ bhp, I must admit to being a bit disappointed. It doesn't seem a lot quicker than a standard 1.9 ?? The compressor stall makes a nice noise through the gear change but you can't really hear the turbo whistling at all...? I realize it will always be a 205 and never a GT2 but I'm sure it isn't as powerful as it should be.

 

...I guess the first port of call is to fit a boost guage and see what the turbo is doing - and whether my "air-box" (patent pending) is the cause of any eventual loss in power. The problem here is that rolling road tuning hardly exists and would involve hundreds of KM's to get it looked at.

 

To all of you out there with a successful conversion I have a question - what kind of comparison would you give the 2.0T compared to other standard road-going cars? I've had a 205 with an Mi16 engine on twin webers and it was a lot faster and a damned sight cheaper to build...

 

For info - the high pressure pipe from a RHD 2000 Renault laguna estate 2.0 petrol fits perfectly where I located the steering pump with a slight bit of heating and careful bending - which I incidently had in stock and the 405 turbo diesel gearbox seems perfectly matched to the engine.

 

Any comments as usual....

 

Regards, Rex

 

Fit a guage and wind the boost up to .9/1.0 bar (It'll take it all day long),loose the center silencer,Get the original 1.9 box, strip it down fit a 3.59 Cwp set to it ,then fit that to the car,405 D turbo boxes are way wrong for this conversion,that ones prob got a 4.04 diff and the cogs are completely out !.

See if you can find a DKZ cam ,should be pretty easy out in France I would have though (205 1.9 Cat)

My mates ones running this set up he abuses it wherever he goes its done getting on for 5k now and still hasnt died,it out accelerates scoobys and evos ,and is now faster than it ever was with a Gti6 lump in it with modded cams and emerald injection, that was making 191hp and 154 ft lbs of torque.

 

Havnt had it back on the rolling road with the turbo lump in it,will be very interesting to see what its making

 

We have a TT exhaust manifold T28 turbo and Emerald injection to fit to it in the future will be looking for some serious gains then !

 

Hope that helps mate,the first one we did was very disapointing for all the effort we put into it,have learnt alot since then ! (Thanks to all on the forum )

 

Regards

 

Tris

 

[jackherer 543]

Does the turbo make a noticeble whistle on yours when accelerating hard?

 

If you can hear a whistle and you're not making much power you probably have boost leaks. The last 2.0 turbo conversion I was involved in needed several small leaks fixing before it made impressive power, as you fix one the next weakest point becomes an issue so it can take a while.

[rex 1]

Thanks for the replies fella's - though I'm certainly not in any danger of smoking any scooby's at the lights in present shape.

 

Jack - I was expecting to hear the turbo but it isn't loosing boost like that I don't think. I've got an Evo II Integrale here with a big turbo and a standard exhaust and you really hear it working which I'm certainly not getting from the 205 right now, although I realize they aren't comparable. I did think my airbox would make a slight difference on power but I didn't expect it to be this flat....

 

Whizzer - how have you adjusted the turbo boost? I was under the impression this was all managed by the ECU?

 

(Takes telephone and orders boost guage....)

 

Regards, Rex

[rex 1]

Oh - and the gearbox seems fine to. I presume it's off a 405 td becuase it runs the same clutch cable as the 1.9? A call to Peugeot France with the numbers told me it was definitely from a TD, but which vehicle was not specified??

 

I have previously run this 'box on the 1.9 lump (having been sold it as a 1.9 'box - damned ebay ) and it was terrible after 2nd gear where it litteraly died - now it pulls well with the extra torque....though I need M-O-R-E!!

[whizzer71 0]

Thanks for the replies fella's - though I'm certainly not in any danger of smoking any scooby's at the lights in present shape.

 

Jack - I was expecting to hear the turbo but it isn't loosing boost like that I don't think. I've got an Evo II Integrale here with a big turbo and a standard exhaust and you really hear it working which I'm certainly not getting from the 205 right now, although I realize they aren't comparable. I did think my airbox would make a slight difference on power but I didn't expect it to be this flat....

 

Whizzer - how have you adjusted the turbo boost? I was under the impression this was all managed by the ECU?

 

(Takes telephone and orders boost guage....)

 

Regards, Rex

 

Nice on the Evo II,My brother has a beautifull example in red running a lairy hybrid turbo and some lairy cams (Still cant keep up with Marks 205 turbo though ),you have to disconnect the pipework from the amal valve but leave the wiring plugged in ,then use a daws type bleed valve or an electronic boost controller (Apexi do a good in car unit) and then adjust the boost accordingly,you can get three way or two way bleed valves choice is yours but if you go for a two way one then blank off the bleed return that goes back into the fresh air intake.

There is some info on here some where about where to solder in the wiring for an electronic boost controller (it shows a picture of the pins and the location of where they are on the ECU PCB).

Go for a larger diameter centre section with no silencer and a larger bore straight through rear silencer,then you'll get the nice warble note you are looking for,Itll be a nice warble at idle and then quiter as you are driving it (the turbo seems to silence alot of the noise by itself).

As for the gearbox I cant recommend a hybrid build strongly enough !,It really does make all the difference have that 405 Dt one out and check the figures on the cwp,I recently stripped a xantia Dturbo box and that was awfull the cwp was a 4.04 and the gearset was all over the place not suited to a 205 at all.

Once the boost is wound up the torque is phenominal and you'll definitely need a good box to use it to its best effect,nice low diff ratio with some nice long gears and itll pull the little 205 along a bit more like you were expecting !

Go reap the rewards !,Its worth having

 

Tris

[danpug 1]

Sorry to jump in on your thread rex but can an electronic boost controller allow you to have low/high boost at the flick of a switch so you could drive around on low boost most of the time and when you want more grunt turn it to high boost?

[whizzer71 0]

Sorry to jump in on your thread rex but can an electronic boost controller allow you to have low/high boost at the flick of a switch so you could drive around on low boost most of the time and when you want more grunt turn it to high boost?

 

 

Never used one myself but my brother has on many applications,Ill have a chat with him and get some answers ,Will post findings in due course .

 

Tris

Edited December 4, 2007 by whizzer71

[danpug 1]

Thanks.

[Crazy-legs! 0]

Sorry to jump in on your thread rex but can an electronic boost controller allow you to have low/high boost at the flick of a switch so you could drive around on low boost most of the time and when you want more grunt turn it to high boost?

 

 

Yes. Thats the main advantage of running an E.B.C. Ive got a GReddy Profec-B to go on my 205. i used to run it on my Charade turbo, with the intention of running low boost for the dailly drive, and high boost for when i wanted to play. But in in the end i just left it on high (1.3 Bar!).

[danpug 1]

How would it work with aftermarket management?

[Crazy-legs! 0]

It no different to running a bleed-valve, or mechanical controller. The boost is just managed via a solinoid connected to the controller, usually with a vacuum/boost pipe connected to it so it can measure, and adjust accordingly.

[tom_m 0]

How would it work with aftermarket management?

 

if you're going to go to the expense of getting aftermarket engine management get one that is capable of controlling the boost itself.

[danpug 1]

I've got a dta which does control boost, just not 100% how it all works! If you could drop me a pm explaining it a bit i'd be grateful, i've intruded on this thread too much already!

[rex 1]

Thanks for all your replies.

 

I've ordered a Stacks boost guage and fitting kit though it won't be available 'till January...

 

The more I think about it, the more I realize my "air-box" is most likely the culprit - everything else seems in perfect order and the engine compression is perfect. Two questions - is the 4x4 cosworth intercooler higher than the 2wd or is it simply fatter? If the I/C has to be visible I may as well go the whole hog and have the fat 'un if it'll fit in the hole...

 

Also, for those with gearbox knowledge - I can get a GTi6 'box for next to nowt from a mate in the UK - and I'm going this weekend. Does it work well with this engine (when it's working properly that is ) ? Will it mean effing about with driveshafts or will the 309 one's fit?

 

Thanks again to all those who take the time to reply...

 

Regards, Rex

[whizzer71 0]

Thanks for all your replies.

 

I've ordered a Stacks boost guage and fitting kit though it won't be available 'till January...

 

The more I think about it, the more I realize my "air-box" is most likely the culprit - everything else seems in perfect order and the engine compression is perfect. Two questions - is the 4x4 cosworth intercooler higher than the 2wd or is it simply fatter? If the I/C has to be visible I may as well go the whole hog and have the fat 'un if it'll fit in the hole...

 

Also, for those with gearbox knowledge - I can get a GTi6 'box for next to nowt from a mate in the UK - and I'm going this weekend. Does it work well with this engine (when it's working properly that is ) ? Will it mean effing about with driveshafts or will the 309 one's fit?

 

Thanks again to all those who take the time to reply...

 

Regards, Rex

 

Not suited to turbo engine mate,Get yourselt a Xsara Vts box and fit either 3.59 or a 3.47 or a 1.9 Gti box and fit either a 3.59 or 3.47 fd.

 

Good luck

 

Tris.

 

[rex 1]

Hiya Tris,

 

"3.59 or a 3.47"

 

Which 'boxes do these final drives come from and how are they distinguisable? Also, what's better about the Xsara box? Does it run the same clutch cable?

 

Whilst I haven't been too far yet in mine, and obviously it isn't up to power (yet), the first four gears at least seemed well suited??

 

Regards, Rex

[whizzer71 0]

Hiya Tris,

 

"3.59 or a 3.47"

 

Which 'boxes do these final drives come from and how are they distinguisable? Also, what's better about the Xsara box? Does it run the same clutch cable?

 

Whilst I haven't been too far yet in mine, and obviously it isn't up to power (yet), the first four gears at least seemed well suited??

 

Regards, Rex

 

Xsara has reverse pull clutch cable so you will have to mod the cable a bit to get the set up to work,Pm me your email add and i'll send asome pics showing how to do this,Xsara gearset is better as has slightly different gearing to 1.9 Gti,Although you can use 1.9 Gti if you cant find a Xsara box. (See below)

 

205 GTI 1.9/1.9 2.92 1.85 1.36 1.07 0.87

 

Xsara VTS 2.92 1.86 1.28 0.95 0.74

 

Use the .87 5th of the 1.9 box with Xsara gearset if you decide to go this route,With a 3.59 diff youll get this result with a rev limit of 6800.

 

custom 44 69 100 135 147

 

And with 3.47 diff

 

custom 45 71 103 139 152

 

Again with a limit of 6800,Im not sure if the turbo engine goes to that at the limit but if its 6500 then those figures will be a little lower.

 

The 3.47 diff is from 205 Diesel BE3 and the 3.59 that I got came from a 309 1.6 carb BE1 box (Code 2BL90) (real old car prob about 87/88 year)

 

I havent got the code for the Xsara box but Im sure some one on here will have,My one came from Dixon off here and my mates one came from a breaker in the Uk,both boxes had the correct gearsets and Fd's when stripped so I guess you'll have to rely on the honesty of the supplier (unless your'e lucky enough to find one in a breakers still in the car and then youll know 100 % !).

Get yourself a cam from the DKZ 1.9 Cat engined 205/309 Gti's ,the engine is so much livelier with this in it compared with a std unit. (even at .5bar boost).

 

Good luck

 

Tris

 

Edited December 9, 2007 by whizzer71

[craig f90 0]

I boought a car mag due to the fact it featured a 2.0t 205, he had 6 speed but was going back to a 1.9. Better geared he said. Im happy with my 1.9 box.

[whizzer71 0]

I boought a car mag due to the fact it featured a 2.0t 205, he had 6 speed but was going back to a 1.9. Better geared he said. Im happy with my 1.9 box.

 

 

Depends how much power your engine is making mate,once you start winding the boost up the 1.9 box becomes all but useless in the lower gears !

 

Tris

[rex 1]

Well......it just sh!t a big end.

 

Tried another intercooler. Tried another gearbox. My conclusion - this project was a money pit, it wasn't much faster than a stanard 1.9 and it would have been a load quicker with a 16 valve engine - and a damned sight easier.

 

Sorry to be negative but I'm sick of the sight of this heap.

 

Despite that, I' like to say a big thanks to all who spent time answering the many questions I had over this project. I wouldn't have even got it started if it wasn't for your contributions. But I've had enough....

 

I'm going sixteen valve.....

 

See you all in the new year.

 

Rex