405 Mi16 Gti180

[Guest franco]

sounds like a sweet conversion there Arb!! Post pix if possible. Sorry can't help you out with your query though

[Guest Arblist]

I had a few issues getting it to fit, will post a few pics when i get my camera working...... lol

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

Right people, i have completed the engine swap in my 405 mi16, the xu9j4 engine went bang, so i dropped an EW10j4 (206gti180 lump) in.

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Was it your pix that went up on the psooc forum?

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

yup, thats a pic just after it was got running.....

 

Ah ha! So it is your car after all. No offence but it looks filthy in those pics. Have you cleaned it since then?

[Guest Robley]

Whats the little box for, you got hyraulics on it to

[Guest Arblist]

Whats the little box for, you got hyraulics on it to

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The little box is the breakout box for the DTA P8 PRO engine ECU. It allows me to change the fueling and ign advance in real time whilst mapping the ecu.

 

And yes i have cleaned it now... lol

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

More pics of the car.

Whenever anyone talks about stuffing the gti180 into the 205 everyone says the sump will hang too low to get clearance of speed bump etc - how does it sit in the 405?

[Guest Arblist]

More pics of the car.

Whenever anyone talks about stuffing the gti180 into the 205 everyone says the sump will hang too low to get clearance of speed bump etc - how does it sit in the 405?

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It sits very well indeed. the sump is no lower than the XU9J4 that was there before. The only real hassle is the exhaust manifold, which is a huge 4 into 1 affair, much bigger than the Mi16 one. Custom engine mounts all round, but it runs on the 206 gearbox, with absolutly standard Mi16 drive shafts. even the mi16 speedo drive fits the gearbox. I can imagine it would be one hell of a squeese in a 205, but in a 405, no problem at all really.

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

Good one. And I guess the only 405 Mi16-GTI180 in the country?

[cybernck 400 1 Cars]

wow, amazing!

 

please tell us a bit more about the setup.

 

was the screen there only for mapping or do you run it as a complex gauge system all day long?

[Guest franco]

Good one. And I guess the only 405 Mi16-GTI180 in the country?

 

Maybe the world? Didn't think I would see this type of conversion, would of thought these engines would still be considerably expensive given how new they still are (well, at least in Australia anyway). Brilliant lateral thinking.

 

But a quick question, how did I end up starting this thread?

[cybernck 400 1 Cars]

i split it from his original thread about suspension.

[Guest franco]

keep it on the topic ay....

[James504 12]

That?s amazing! It looks like it was designed to fit in there. Can we let those stupid 205 boys have our xu9j4's and xu10j4's, now that we have something better? 405 Mi180!!

[Guest Arblist]

There is a bit of a story, so here goes......

 

I knocked the bottom end out of my xu9j4 engine, so was in search for a crankshaft. I had my trusty 106 rallye back on the road, so there was no rush. I started to trawl the internet for a new crank, and stumbled onto a french site where i got talking to a french guy who knew the location of a 405 T16 which had been written off in france. I made the phone calls, grabbed a transit van and got over there, only to find that the T16 had been sold from under me. I was just a tad angry, and the scrapyard owner, fearing for his life, pointed me to a heap of metal that used to be a 206 RC (the french version of the GTi180). we did the deal, and i got the engine and box. At this stage i still wasnt exactly sure what it was, i knew it was 2.0l twin cam 16v and it was peugeot. Did alot of homework, and it was an EW10J4 engine, complete with VVT and all the rest..... I also got the engine loom and the engine ECU, not realising that the 206 is all multiplexed, so the ecu was useless to me. DTA to the rescue, and a few weeks, yes weeks, wiring the engine, and merging the the original loom into the new engine loom, and then getting the DTA to run it all. all the gauges work, even the oil level/temp guage works..... The only downsides to the conversion are:

 

1st gear is a little high (rev limiter cuts in at 48mph in first) but saying that, 25,000 miles on, and the clutch is still in one piece.

 

I had to remove the front anit roll bar. It does lean a little on corners, but traction is improved on tight corners when powering out (ever pulled out of a wet junction on lock and the inside wheel spins?? mine doesnt any more)

[cybernck 400 1 Cars]

that's an eventful story .

 

 

have you had your car rolling roaded (you have obviously had to)?

 

was the screen there only for mapping or do you run it as a complex gauge system all day long?

 

 

yes, apparently no arb makes for better traction and handling in wet, but i couldn't live without one .

[RobMGti 0]

Thats alot of miles done on one clutch, very impressive!

 

I doubt i could live without a front arb as well. Would love to seem some power graphs after using the DTA management, i assumed you would of got marked improvement over using the standard ecu.

 

Rob

[Hilgie 16 2 Cars]

Hi Arblist,

 

Looking at the pics (I got them a while ago from Kriskarrera) it seems like the engine is sitting at a slight angle.

 

I modified the upper engine mount to reduce the strain on the driveshafts and have the engine sitting in straight.

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

I got them a while ago from Kriskarrera

I modified the upper engine mount to reduce the strain on the driveshafts and have the engine sitting in straight.

What car you got yours in then?

[Rippthrough 98]

I had to remove the front anit roll bar. It does lean a little on corners, but traction is improved on tight corners when powering out (ever pulled out of a wet junction on lock and the inside wheel spins?? mine doesnt any more)

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Nope.

 

 

Were there any 180's that weren't multiplexed? I know some of the early 206's weren't.

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

ever pulled out of a wet junction on lock and the inside wheel spins??

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Eh? So what's the point in having an antiroll bar if it doesn't help?

[Guest Arblist]

As far as i know the early 206gti 130's are normal, and the later ones and all the 206gti 180's are multiplexed.

 

as for the antiroll bar (ARB) not helping, you have to understand what an arb does. It trys to stop body roll by transfering downwards force onto the outside wheel, it does this by reducing downwards force on the inside wheel, thereby reducing body roll (leaning). now this is ideal for fast and medium corners as it gives the car poise and helps grip because it keeps the tyres flatter to the track (road) surface. When you get to a tight corner (hairpin) however, what happens is the inside wheel now has so little weight on it (due to the arb transfering the weight to the outside wheel) the inside wheel breaks traction and spins up. as far as i know 2wd Mi16 did not have LSD's fitted (which would of course solve this problem). I dont run an ARB, and yes i have more body roll than normal, but not that much more. I live out in the country, muddy lanes, bumps everywhere, and the traction i gain is worth the trade off in body roll. Suspension is always a compromise, it just depends what you use it for.

[Hilgie 16 2 Cars]

I modified the upper engine mount to reduce the strain on the driveshafts and have the engine sitting in straight.

What car you got yours in then?

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206GTi138 engine into a 205. But the enginemounts are the same on 205 and 405. And the enginemounts on the 138 and 180 are also identical. We had the problem of the engine sitting not straight as well and modified the upper enginemount.

 

Before:

 

After:

Edited March 17, 2006 by Hilgert

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

Nice.

They might call it EW but really it's just an "updated" XU.

 

Probably marketing insisting on a code change so that the salesmen could say "Ooh look our latest cars have this new EW engine..."

[RobMGti 0]

I havent read through the whole post but i assume thats a dry sump setup?