Gti6 Parts That Fit On A Mi16

[SPGTi 2]

I have a load of GTi-6 bits that I would like to use on a MI16 bottom end, I would just like to know whether they are just a straight replacement.

Gti-6 sump - does this bolt straight onto Mi16 bottom end ? If yes can I cut off all the extra brackets which I presume were for the power steering etc. ?

Are the alternators and starter motors the same ?

Are the GTi6 and Mi16 topmounts the same ?

Is the water ditribution block on the rear of the GTi6 block suitable for a MI16 ?

Are any of the pulleys / tensioners useable on the Mi16 block ?

 

I haven't got a Mi16 bottom end yet so cannot check.

 

I have decided that my trusty 8v will be replaced by a Gti6 / Mi16 hybrid as inspired by Cameron. I am just trying to source the bits.

 

cheers

 

Steve

[James_R 3]

 

Gti-6 sump - does this bolt straight onto Mi16 bottom end ? If yes can I cut off all the extra brackets which I presume were for the power steering etc. ? - Yes with out the spacer plate

Are the alternators and starter motors the same ? Stater motor not alt

Are the GTi6 and Mi16 topmounts the same ? No Mi one is different to 6 one

Is the water ditribution block on the rear of the GTi6 block suitable for a MI16 ? Different again, XU7 one has a single outlet similar to a GTi6 oneAre any of the pulleys / tensioners useable on the Mi16 block ? Not checked, but again XU7 uses same stuff as the 6

 

Also the cambelt pulley from the Gti-6 is worth using and oil pump and pump sprocket, the later ones are single piece so if the 22mm bolt comes loose the oil pressure won't drop off like Mi's do, also the bottom pulley is 7degree's (half a tooth or so) different between the GTi-6 and Mi bottom pulleys.

[welshpug 1,627]

depends if you mean alloy or iron Mi16.

[SPGTi 2]

Sorry 1.9 alloy Mi16 bottom end.

 

Thanks James for the reply.

I have been searching for a couple of hours and found most of the sump answers.

 

Any more advice on bolting the GTi6 head to the alloy bottom end would be appreciated.

If anyone has a 1.9 MI bottom end that they are selling (or giving away !!) please pm me.

 

cheers

 

Steve

[luggy 13]

I have decided that my trusty 8v will be replaced by a Gti6 / Mi16 hybrid as inspired by Cameron. I am just trying to source the bits.

 

cheers

 

Steve

 

 

What engine management are you thinking of using?

Edited June 24, 2008 by luggy

[Cameron 16]

Any more advice on bolting the GTi6 head to the alloy bottom end would be appreciated.

 

You need to use a combination of the Mi and 6 cam covers, it's a bit of a hassle but fairly easy. You need the lower Mi one that covers the crank pulley. The outer Mi one that covers everything else needs to be chopped in half so you just use the bottom part, then the top half of the 6 one gets cut off to fit and the 2 bonded together. The rear upper cover from the 6 (bolts behind the cam pulleys) needs to be modified slightly to clear the engine mount and the water pump. It sounds like a bit of a faff (it is) but it's very doable. Have a look at my progress thread on FSC, it has pics of how I did it.

 

Don't know about the tensioners but as James says the crank pulley is useable and a fair bit lighter.

 

Your best bet is to get a scrap Mi16 engine, with a cambelt failure or head gasket etc, and a GTi6 with a knackered bottom end and then you'll have all the bits you could possibly need. Im so so glad I bought a whole 6 engine for my conversion as it saved me a huge amount in the long run! Im still pulling bits and bobs off it now!

[SPGTi 2]

What engine management are you thinking of using?

 

I have a fully built up Megasquirt that has been acting as a paperweight for the last 12 months, so will start off with that.

 

Steve

[Alastairh 47]

Are the alternators and starter motors the same ? Stater motor not alt

 

Alternators do. There seems to be a difference of 8v and 16v, or maybe just GTI6 ones different (Something i haven't continued my research into).

 

But put it this way, my old GTI6 use to have a 8v XU9 one, and my current 8v has a 8v Xu10 wurbo one

 

The 16v or the GTI6 ones wont fit though.

Edited June 24, 2008 by Alastairh

[Cameron 16]

Probably means the 6 block has a different alt mount, rather than the actual alt being different. Maybe it's the lower adjuster thingy that's in a different place.

[SPGTi 2]

Probably means the 6 block has a different alt mount, rather than the actual alt being different. Maybe it's the lower adjuster thingy that's in a different place.

 

It was the actual alternator I was referring to as the 6 engine I have seems to have a nicy shiny new one which I was hoping would fit on the Mi16 bottom end (when I get one ), not the associated brackets.

 

I was also thinking of using a coilpack and 205 auto plug leads instead of the coil on plug 6 arrangement. Any reason why I shouldn't do this??

 

I have basically printed out Camerons thread on the other forum as a bit of guide. A very good read, I am sure there is a link to his thread somewhere.

 

steve

[Cameron 16]

@ using my thread as a guide!

 

I ditched the coil-per-plug setup after talking to Dave Walker and a bloke from DTA, said that for the complications it causes it isn't really worth it. Im using a Vectra coil pack now which works just fine. As for plug leads, Im not sure what fits.. I used Corsa leads but they were a bit long and the plug boots were too long. Still, they work so Im not worried about it.

[returnofjim 0]

@ using my thread as a guide!

 

I ditched the coil-per-plug setup after talking to Dave Walker and a bloke from DTA, said that for the complications it causes it isn't really worth it. Im using a Vectra coil pack now which works just fine. As for plug leads, Im not sure what fits.. I used Corsa leads but they were a bit long and the plug boots were too long. Still, they work so Im not worried about it.

 

Any coil pack equipped peugeot/citroen 106/205/306/405/605/xm/zx/xantia etc will do, theres hundreds of them in scrap yards, the choice of leads all depends on where u mount the coil. I used some 8mm silicone ones for a 405 2.0 on a gti6 engine, and on an mi16 i got some corsa gsi ones which have the extra long reach ends on. Both these engines i made an L shaped alloy bracket what bolted to the side of the head for mounting the coil pack.

 

Am not sure if megasquirt supports a 60-2 tooth trigger wheel without using the extra firmware which is a bit of a pain. I would try and find a DTA E48 or something similart on ebay, the dta is so easy to setup compared to the megasquirt and you can get the software easily from the dta website.

[SPGTi 2]

Am not sure if megasquirt supports a 60-2 tooth trigger wheel without using the extra firmware which is a bit of a pain. I would try and find a DTA E48 or something similart on ebay, the dta is so easy to setup compared to the megasquirt and you can get the software easily from the dta website.

 

My MS unit is all setup with extra and 2 coil drivers. It should support the 60-2 trigger. I keep looking out for a DTA to carry out your mod on but none seem to come up.

I will pick your brain on Sunday.

 

cheers

 

Steve

[VisaGTi16v 1]

If you bolt the gti6 sump straight to the mi then you loose the block brace which people refer to as a spacer which you dont want to do. You can fit the sump with the spacer but you will need a few different bolts and a PeterT oil pump pickup extension

[James_R 3]

the Mi is specific on the engine mount to 8v or Mi alts, some s16 ones fit, but they need the two tabs on each side and then one at the top, rather than the GTi-6 type ones which have a single central tab top and bottom that locate in to the mount (in a fixed position). so not a Gti-6 one no.

 

 

A neater solution is to use a coilpack off an XU7 engine, then it just attaches straight to the head, no leads etc.. and looks a fair bit tidier

[SPGTi 2]

the Mi is specific on the engine mount to 8v or Mi alts, some s16 ones fit, but they need the two tabs on each side and then one at the top, rather than the GTi-6 type ones which have a single central tab top and bottom that locate in to the mount (in a fixed position). so not a Gti-6 one no.

 

oh well looks like ebay then for the 6 alternator.

A neater solution is to use a coilpack off an XU7 engine, then it just attaches straight to the head, no leads etc.. and looks a fair bit tidier

 

Do you happen to have any pics ? I have a coil which I was going to use on my 8v that bolted straight onto the the later 3.1 cat cars water housing thingy.

 

cheers

 

Steve

[jonnie205 1]

i have a 6 alternator, bolts and engine mounting bracket if needed

[James_R 3]

I'll grab one over the weekend for you, basically it just looks like a GTi6 top cover but when you remove it the coil packs comes with it, it has a plug on the side of it same the usualy coil pack plugs, the 3.1 sytel siemens coil pack will work fine, I just think these look pretty neat.

[Sandy 189]

To put the regular XU7J4 or XU10J4R coilpack on the GTi6 requires the coil on plug lugs to be ground off. The oil filler cap was moved slightly between the alloy and plastic cam cover designs too.

[Cameron 16]

Erm, you don't need a 6 alternator if you're using the Mi bottom end, you just need an Mi one. You'll be using the old Mi engine mount so it will fit.

 

Ah, is that brace definitely needed then? (when swapping to 6 sump)

[SPGTi 2]

Erm, you don't need a 6 alternator if you're using the Mi bottom end, you just need an Mi one. You'll be using the old Mi engine mount so it will fit.

 

My wording must have confused. I have a 6 alternator and my comment was that it looks like I will now be selling it on ebay not looking to buy one

 

 

Ah, is that brace definitely needed then? (when swapping to 6 sump)

 

Not sure on that. It is needed if you want to run an oil pump with extended pickup. If you look on PeterT's website there is a good pic of the windage tray fixed into the modified spacer / brace.

 

Steve

[Cameron 16]

Aha OK I see now.

 

I was looking to use the windage tray but apparently the main cap bolts are different thread on XU9 and XU10 blocks. Just had a look at Peter's site, some pretty good info on there. I think I'll look into a different method of fitting the tray though, and I don't really fancy dropping the sump down by keeping the spacer / brace. Might be an idea to chop the braces out and get them welded into a 6 sump.