1.6 Gearbox On To 1.9 Motor...

[mikebullock84 0]

hello, ive just finished rebuilding the motor on my 1.9 dimma, ive got a polished and ported head, piper cam and pulley, etc and lots of new standard engine parts. As the engine and gearbox are out of the car, its the perfect opportunity for me to possibly change.

 

I believe i currently have a BE3 is it? well its reverse bottom right, who changed to 1.6 for faster acceleration? how much is the top speed cut by, and is it unbearable at say 80mph? i rang my local scrappy and they both have the lift up reverse and the bottom right one in stock for about 60 quid, so thats no problem, just the case of seeing if its worth going for it?

 

cheers mike

[Richie-Van-GTi 70 2 Cars]

Depends how you drive the car, a 1.6 box is god for acceleration but can be a pain if you regularly do 60 stretches etc. Also be prepared to lose at high speed races. IIRC 1st 3 gears are pretty similar anyway.

Theres loads of threads on the subject. Search gear ratios and you'll find all the info you need

[mikebullock84 0]

yeah its a tricky one, iv never had the car on the road, so i cant really judge it on my driving style, and by how much driving im going to do in it?! if you say that the 1-3 gears are similar, then i think il stay with the 1.9 box, as they are longer.

 

yeh i did a search to start with, but didnt come up with much, cheers though a for a quick reply

[steve@cornwall 100]

As a daily driver the 1.9 with 1.6 'box gets quite tedious IMO. I even bought a 1.9 'box to replace it. But the car's not a daily driver anymore, so it can stay.Basically it's fun but not practical and the lower rev. limit severely restricts top speed potential.(again IMO) Frustrating having to lift off the gas 'cos the limiter's bouncing in 5th!!! , yet b road overtaking is a hoot.

[Baz 421]

I've never found 1.6 boxes annoying. Only on an Mi16 road car i changed to an Mi box as motorway cruising (3 figures+) were tedious.

 

I really hate 1.9 boxes.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

A 1.9 engine suit's the 1.9 box, I;ve got this on mine and a mate's swaping from a 1.6 box to a 1.9 on his too as at Motorway speeds the engine is reving it's ***s off.

Just beware of any scrappy boxes as they are rarely what they sell them as, All they know it's a Peugeot BE box, The amount of Derv boxes I;ve had off GTi's is just silly

[Mark80 0]

Ok I'm a confused amatuer. Am I right in saying there are four different GTI boxes then? A BE1 for the 1.6, A BE1 for the 1.9, a BE3 for the 1.6 and a BE3 for the 1.9? And do they both fit on the same blocks?

Sorry for being stupid, i searched but still confused!

Edited May 28, 2008 by Mark80

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

There are loads of BE boxes, All fited to all XU engine'd PSA car's and van's, I hate to think of how many different ones there are,

[pug_ham 242 3 Cars]

I've got a 1.6 box on my track car & have recently done over 2k in a long weekend on the PSOOC euro tour, its not that bad but worth it for the acceleration on all terrain.

 

If you find hitting the limiter in fifth a problem & its happening often you must have a nice quiet stretch of private road near you to get to 120mph+ that often.

 

Graham.

[mikebullock84 0]

miles, im lucky that the nearest scrap yard to me is a peugeot only, they know their stuff, ive been going there ever since i was 17 to hoard gti wheels to go on my junior diesel!

 

well i think il stay with the 1.9 box then, i bought another 1.9 gti car the other day, only 200 quid, needs a starter motor and exhaust, the previous owner claims it has a 1.6 gearbox, so il be able to compare once the dimma and this one are on the road!

[Mark80 0]

so how can you tell the difference between a BE1 1.6 box and a BE1 1.9 box when they are out of the car?

[welshpug 1,627]

count the teeth on the F/D

[steve@cornwall 100]

If you find hitting the limiter in fifth a problem & its happening often you must have a nice quiet stretch of private road near you to get to 120mph+ that often.

 

Graham.

 

It's more that on the rare occasion you do hit the limiter in 5th - it's just the last thing you want to happen!! I think even more annoying is losing those few mph in second, needing to change rapidly at 57 ish when overtaking? comes up so quickly it often hits the limiter when alongside- and cheap tyres are a no-no in the wet pulling off in first,or changing into second at full tilt.... But for a weekend fun car - it's great!

[pug_ham 242 3 Cars]

count the teeth on the F/D

There no need to go as far as counting the teeth, remove the diff housing & the size of the crownwheel & pinion gear are stamped on the crownwheel.

 

It's more that on the rare occasion you do hit the limiter in 5th - it's just the last thing you want to happen!! I think even more annoying is losing those few mph in second, needing to change rapidly at 57 ish when overtaking? comes up so quickly it often hits the limiter when alongside- and cheap tyres are a no-no in the wet pulling off in first,or changing into second at full tilt.... But for a weekend fun car - it's great!

OK, mine has a higher rev limit so over 60 in second is possible before I hit the limiter which I try to avoid doing anyway.

 

Mines an occasional weekend / trackday car with a diff & decent tyres so even in the damp I can set off plenty quick enough without an wheelspin but still get a chirp going into second in the dry. I tried a 1.9 box for one trackday & it took some fun out of the day for me so I swapped back.

 

Each to their own in the end though.

 

Graham.

[Mark80 0]

count the teeth on the F/D

 

 

There no need to go as far as counting the teeth, remove the diff housing & the size of the crownwheel & pinion gear are stamped on the crownwheel.

 

Great thanks guys, so how many teeth should there be on each and what is each one stamped with to let me know?

[pug_ham 242 3 Cars]

The 1.9 GTi crownwheel should be stamped 59x16 which works out at 3.6875.

 

The 1.6 one is stamped 65x 16 which makes it 4.063.

 

Graham.

[Mark80 0]

The 1.9 GTi crownwheel should be stamped 59x16 which works out at 3.6875.

 

The 1.6 one is stamped 65x 16 which makes it 4.063.

 

Graham.

 

Awesome info, cheers Graham

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

1.9 gearbox suits 1.9 8v engine perfectly IMO, they don't usually pull (properly) above 6000rpm and feel pokey low down anyway. I wouldn't like to drive a 1.6 gearbox in an 8v engine.

 

1.6 gearbox on the Mi16 is another story and feels great as you've got an extra 1000rpm to play which makes a huge difference IMO. It also seems to be happier spinning over at 4000rpm on the motorway.

[jeremy 68]

I had a 1.6 box on my 1.9 and all it did was chew up cheap tyres on the front, and terrible in the wet, however in the dry it pulled nicely except you found you were changing up the gears pretty quick.

[Anthony 1,000]

Frantic fun. Everything a 205 GTi should be.

 

Been running a fettled 1.9 engine and 1.6 box combo for 15k miles now on my daily driver '89 GTi, and it makes the '92 GTi which is still running a 1.9 box feel dull by comparison. Whether a 1.6 box is any faster against the clock than a 1.9 I've no idea - can't see why it wouldn't be so long as you can put the power down - but crucially it feels quicker and more enjoyable.

 

I do plenty of motorway miles as well (more than the majority on here in a 205 I'd imagine), so I really do laugh at all the jokers moaning that it's too short for the motorway - funny how 1.6 GTi owners have managed just fine for years, isn't it?

 

Limiter in 5th is about 125mph@6500rpm which is plenty for any UK track and more than fast enough on the road.

 

So long as your 1.9 engine is a good one that keeps pulling strongly past 6000rpm, rather than a tired knackered example that's wheezing and thrown in the towel at 5500rpm, then I'd choose a 1.6 box (coupled with 1.6 flywheel) over a 1.9 everyday.

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

Yea I think it's all down to how your 1.9 8v engine runs. I remember mine pulling really strong but being breathless/rough over 6000rpm so I think shorter gearing would have just slown it down.

[pug_ham 242 3 Cars]

I think Anthony hit the nail on the head, if your 1.9 is in fine health or mildly modifed the the 1.6 box doesn't hold a problem in use on a 1.9.

 

As I said earlier, my limiter is 7k but it pulls round to it easily although I can't give a direct comparison against a 1.9 box on it as I've never had one fitted long enough to give an accurate one.

 

Horses for courses, especially if you use a 1.9 on track the 1.9 is better when mated to the 1.6 gearbox, especially at somewhere like Cadwell.

 

Graham.