Roadspeed Vs Sprintlines Vs Gaz

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

Right there's plenty of information about each of these sets of suspension, but nothing comparing them. I'm very shortly about to buy one of them but I'm not sure which. I'll be using my 205 for road and track and will be replacing the horrible low stiff springs that are on at the moment.

 

So this is the way I see it at the moment -

 

Skip Brown Cars Roadspeed phase 1 -

 

Basically Sprintlines, but with decent springs from what I've read, is that right? Anyone got an idea on price and if it includes rear dampers? I know you can ring SBC but I don't want to do that unless I'm pretty sure I want to buy this kit.

 

Bilstein Sprintlines -

 

Really good suspension, should handle B roads and track but more suited to track. Come with rubbish springs which need replacing with something else. What springs are a good swap? Cost, just short of £500 + the price of the extra springs. Any tips on where to buy from?

 

GAZ -

 

Coilovers can be had for £350 which seems a bargain, but are they as good as the other two? I wouldn't mind the adjustability but not at the expense of quality/handling as I don't think I'll do anything with it or really know what to do. If I did go for these what springs do people recommend?

 

Does anyone have any comments on that? Is there anything else I need to be upgrading at the same time ie top mounts, rear beam mounts etc? Which is going to be the best solution for my current situation and allow for going a bit more track orientated in future? I don't drive fast on the public roads anyway as I don't feel safe doing it so something slightly less suitable for the B roads would probably be ok.

 

Also finally, what's the deal with the Bilstein challenge spec/group n stuff? I've seen people talking about inserts and spring pans and get a bit lost there.

 

Any help will be much appreciated!

[kilauea 7]

I just bought KYB AGX shocks. There are others on here who rate them and they are pretty cheap too.

I paid 267.03 for 4 dampers delivered from buy-parts-by.

I'm going to be using -35mm springs from Autofive and Grp N top mounts and Grp A rear beam mounts from BBM.

 

Hopefully fitting this week so will post back with impressions.

 

gaz

[Wicker man 2]

i had billy sprintline on my last 205 & it was top notch

[Simes 248 2 Cars]

I've got Skip Brown Roadspeed dampers on the rear - Basically they are revalved Billies set up for the 205.

Brilliant no complaints - now where's that £260 to buy the fronts!

Edited January 28, 2008 by Simes

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

I've got Skip Brown Roadspeed dampers on the rear - Basically they are revalved Billies set up for the 205.

Brilliant no complaints - now where's that £260 to buy the fronts!

 

When you say they're revalved Bilsteins, do you mean the Sprintlines and not the lower spec ones?

[Super Josh 4]

When you say they're revalved Bilsteins, do you mean the Sprintlines and not the lower spec ones?

 

Yep, apparently revalved to SBCs specification.

 

 

 

Josh

[Toddy 7]

When I ordered mine I had to wait a while as they had non in stock and I needed to send my original damper struts to them so that they can be machined out to fit the re-valved dampers to SBC spec in Germany.

 

I have a feeling that the fronts are gravel inserts or a hybrid between gravel and tarmac inserts, as the SBC phase 2 uses 20mm T/B & 23mm ARB which is what is meant for gravel applications

 

The SBC front roadspeed dampers have a threaded part coming out of the bottom of the damper with a nut attached which is similar to inserts which been posted upon here, the shaft of the damper is about 2inch thick which looks the same as inserts.

 

The rears are Group N billies, unsure whether gravel or Tarmac specific.

 

The front dampers are c. £200 each

Rears c. £100

Plus springs & surcharge

 

They are not cheap but do seem compliant on the road and able to take track abuse, I am happy with them.

 

Most people rate the Challenge spec ones which work out cheaper than SBC, someone who has had both may be able to comment.

 

Cheers

Edited January 28, 2008 by Toddy

[RossD 43]

Most people rate the Challenge spec ones which work out cheaper than SBC, someone who has had both may be able to comment.

 

Cheers

 

From what you have described the 'Challenge' spec sounds very close to the SBC Roadspeed setup. It would be interesting to know what springs the SBC fronts use. (Height, rate, dual rate/progressive etc)

[Toddy 7]

From what you have described the 'Challenge' spec sounds very close to the SBC Roadspeed setup. It would be interesting to know what springs the SBC fronts use. (Height, rate, dual rate/progressive etc)

 

 

I know the fronts are dual rate & a 25mm drop from standard, unsure of the specs.

[hodgy 0]

well as you know ive got GAZ on mine and you know how mine handles and how cheap they were plus you cant beat been able to adjust dampaning, so when you go to the track you can wind them back up to hard then drive off the track and put them back to soft

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

Spring wise, I swear by Eibach and a lot of people put these springs on the Sprintline kit.

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

well as you know ive got GAZ on mine and you know how mine handles and how cheap they were plus you cant beat been able to adjust dampaning, so when you go to the track you can wind them back up to hard then drive off the track and put them back to soft

 

I guess that's the main thing I want to know, GAZ seem too cheap to be good enough , are they as good as Sprintlines/any of the other options?

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

I've had the Sprints, and now have the Challenge shocks.

 

I had the Sprints on my old 205, which got swopped over to my current 205 during the rebuild. Originally, the Sprints were on my old 205 with the standard Ventura springs, which while improving the car from its original shocks etc, it did not set the car alight.

 

Once on my current car with the SBC Roadspeed springs and 309 running gear, it was mightily impressive. Turn-in was sharp and grip was in another league to what I was used to, and even Anthony too (This was a few years ago though).

 

Unfortunately, When on the PSOOC 2005 europe trip I took a Belgian pothole quite badly, damaging the shock.

 

Replaced them with Challenge spec shocks and the car was back to its old self again, if not better.

 

Can't recommend the Challenge shocks enough, just make sure you get decent springs with them.

 

Peter Lloyd Rallying sell them for £140 each up front and £70 each for the rears. They also sell the matching springs for them (manufacturer unknown).

 

I am currently investigating converting my Challenge shocks to coilovers using this sleeve arragement, although it may prove difficult as the Billy strut body is wider than any of the kits available. Bloke at work reckons he could knock some up for me though

 

Get the Challenge setup, believe me you won't regret it. Best suspension out there for the 205 under £500. Just make sure you sort the mounts, bearings etc out too. With all that, your 205 will be amazing to drive......

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

"Mounts, bearings etc"

 

What does that include? Strut top mounts and front wheel bearings I know, are rear beam mounts needed? Any other bushes etc? Anything else at the rear? Worth going to Group N stuff? Hodgy has offered me a pair of standard strut top mounts, but he also said the uprated gear is only about £15.

[GLPoomobile 958]

"Mounts, bearings etc"

 

What does that include? Strut top mounts and front wheel bearings I know, are rear beam mounts needed? Any other bushes etc? Anything else at the rear? Worth going to Group N stuff? Hodgy has offered me a pair of standard strut top mounts, but he also said the uprated gear is only about £15.

 

IMO if you want to have the best from your 205 possible then you need to consider replacing everything related to steering and suspension, but it soon all adds up I know the sensible thing to do is only replace what is worn and actually needs replacing, but then sometimes a part can look healthy to the untrained eye but actually not be. But I digress!

 

I'd replace wishbones bushes (with OE), ARB bushes (with OE, they are poly anyway), and get new front top mount bearings and rubbers (personally, I didn't like Group N rubbers as they made the car far too crashy on the road, but perhaps a really good set of shocks would help reduce that problem). And I'd stick Group A solid mounts in the rear beam.

 

Then if you want to get really anal you could do your wheel bearings, drop links, track rods and ends. After that I guess that just leaves your steering rack (but leave it unless it's know to be worn. Miles says pattern racks are no where near as good, and genuine Pug ones are far from cheap!) and column UJ

 

(obviously you want to have a healthy rear beam as well).

Edited January 29, 2008 by GLPoomobile

[Headling 0]

see these on the bay, are they worth a punt?

 

160203079580 item no.

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

They're the Bilstein standard replacement shocks by the looks of it, good but as I said pretty much standard.

 

I'm warming to this Challenge Spec stuff, I've heard plenty of good things about it but was never sure what it referred to.

 

Unless anyone can tell me the GAZ are just as good?

 

GLPoo - When you say OE, do you mean specifically from Peugeot or are pattern ones as good?

[oli-pug 6 2 Cars]

First things first, get your rear beam inspected and rebuilt if necessary as this is the key to the 205's handling.

 

Once I knew mine was ok, I moved onto the dampers and decided on running Koni adjustables up front with Eibach Pro springs, and Bilstein Grp.N tarmacs on the rear. I found this to be a very decent setup for the money and the rebound rates are well balanced when the Koni's are set to their maximum.

 

Next i made sure all bushes/ balljoints and bearings were tip top. When these are all A1 it really puts a smile on your face!

 

I started by replacing the wishbones with new 309 gti items, this improved front end grip no end! I then fitted Grp.N rubber top mounts from Baker bushes and a new set of top mount bearings for a tighter feeling front end. Now inspect your arb droplinks and bushes and replace if necessary. Check for play in your track rod ends and get the tracking done, i personally like to set at 0'10 toe-out for a better turn-in.

 

When all of this was done, i found the car handled really well in the twisties transitioning from left to right but there was too much understeer on long sweeping corners.

The cheapest way of rectifying this is with a thicker rear arb. I fitted a Whiteline adjustable arb along with a set of Baker Grp.A beam mounts. Lift off oversteer is tamed and turn-in and cornering speed have improved nicely.

[hodgy 0]

well i also have some standard new rear mounts you can have as ive changed to group A rears before i fitted them.

 

you will have to get james to get you a top mount kit as it has new bearings cos you will need to change them when you change the suspension.

 

you defo need to get adjustable rear suspension cos i never get loos, unless at very high speed or when some clown in a skyline gts brakes infront of me round a big bend

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

well i also have some standard new rear mounts you can have as ive changed to group A rears before i fitted them.

 

you will have to get james to get you a top mount kit as it has new bearings cos you will need to change them when you change the suspension.

 

Top mount kit comprises of a metal top mount and nuts, a bearing and a rubber 'donut'. You can get the bearing from GSF (Its a Citroen part though) and the uprated donut from Baker blokey off here along with the GrpN/A rear mounts pending on which you want.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

As GLp has said when you change the rack even if not worn with a std Pug one the steering feel is how I remember them when new many years ago, pattern racks are just missing that something, but as I've said on another post the p/S racks are NLA but the normal ones are for around £100.00 which isn;t bad in my book

Also have to agree with most of the above on change, wichbones, Bushes, bearings etc as it all helps bring the car back alive and positive again

But for a suspension set up the Group 'N's or challenge spec with the Eibach springs are a tried and trusted set up for most people,

Price wise matching Peter Lloyd is no problem at all or even better

[Simes 248 2 Cars]

Bilstein and SBC dampers + Eibach springs have served me fine for years.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

I'm surprised nobody has produced a refurb kit for a standard rack, seeing as you can get them for quickrack conversion kits. There's not really much to a rack anyways. I've just stripped on down to rebuild using a quickrack conversion kit. I had it in bits in about 15mins, couple of circlips and thats it.

 

Get your beam sorted first.......make sure its OK.

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

I'm surprised nobody has produced a refurb kit for a standard rack, seeing as you can get them for quickrack conversion kits. There's not really much to a rack anyways. I've just stripped on down to rebuild using a quickrack conversion kit. I had it in bits in about 15mins, couple of circlips and thats it.

 

Get your beam sorted first.......make sure its OK.

 

It's prob cos there's more money in selling an alleged "refurbished" one complete on exchange as I bet in most cases the rack and pinion doesn't get touched which is probably the more expensive part. I bought a "refurbished" rack from a motor spares shop on exchange and it was crap and had dirt on it that had been painted over so took it back and put my old one back one.

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

Rear beam was lowered before I got it so hopefully will be in good condition but I'll check it over in the summer when it all goes on.

 

Cheers for the advice all, Miles you can expect a pm in a couple of weeks