Tesstuff 222 Posted January 6, 2008 OK , this is just ridiculous now and i need some input as to my next course of action. My trusted experienced mechanic came and had a long (3 hours) look at the car.He listened to my symptoms and he asked me a few questions and then he set about doing some things of his own. It has sat unused for 4 weeks now and the battery was flat so he jump started it and fired it up, started first time and he revved it to maintain idle( this is a major no no as it makes steam come out the exhaust) so we watched the steam for a few minutes and then it was fine.The idle was good and it ran well.Then he took the coolant expansion cap off and looked for the oily film, it wasnt there but he could smell oil from there.We left it a while to warm through and still no signs of oil there at all. So he stopped it and started to look at other ways to see if the head gasket had gone and everything he tried and looked at suggested the head gasket is fine.When taking the rocker cover off it was very clean and he commented it looked good there, oil was a dark brown and no signs of water/oil mix in any way. Then he took the spark plugs out one by one and cylinder one showed a perfect spark plug that looked very healthy.Cylinder two showed a poor spark plug that had more signs of corrosion around the top of the thread and it was darker than the first one.Cylinder three was the same and cylinder four was like cylinder one, looking very good. So he suggested possible overheating or overfuelling at this point.This would fit in with my problem in one way.It now starts with a weak tickover and feels like its going to cut out but it just holds on and then rises to its proper tickover speed.This shows that a component is doing its job in making the tickover correct but it seems like another component is failing or has failed that makes the tickover correct instantly from startup and this second component takes over and compensates for that , which might mean the overfuelling and thus the condition of the spark plugs. So he says there is no need for the head to come off as he is 99% certain its not head gasket.He suspects that some component controls the idle from startup and that is failing or has failed and the second component is taking over and doing a rescue operation and keeping all ok. The car runs perfectly once started and he says its a great car after looking at it and then test driving it. So my problems are as follows :- on startup i get a weak tickover and its slightly lumpy for less than 10 seconds and then something seems to take over and make the tickover rise up to just under 1,000 and all the lumpyness disappears. if i dont touch the accelerator during the start up i get just those actions mentioned, but if i touch the accelerator during startup then i get smoke/steam out the back for about 2 mins. if he is correct and it isnt head gasket trouble then it seems a component or components that controls idle/fuelling is not working correctly. i ideally need some tips and advice from people with more experience of this engine and also possibly to be able to let someone else who is excellent on these engines see it now.Now we think its not head gasket i would be confident driving it to someone if they can help me.It would be great if someone had spare parts to swap with mine to trial and error and diagnose that way.So if anyone is not too far away and wants to help out i would obviously see them right. Any help is gratefully received. Regards Daz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miles 331 1 Cars Posted January 6, 2008 Has he got any pressure testing or leak down testing equipment as steam out the back is not normally a good sign, Do you loose water at all? If the head has never been off before the gaskets tend to eat away with the lack of coolent changes which leads onto other thing's but I won;t go down that route just yet. The start up sounds very normal for one of these as most of the parts are worn like the AFM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tesstuff 222 Posted January 6, 2008 Hi Miles thankyou for your reply He hadnt brought any of that type of equipment with him but said he would next Sunday when he comes again. It doesnt lose water and its never over heated and the fan cuts in two marks from the end each time and it never goes past that point. Also it doesnt use any oil. Does anyone know how good Paul is at 205 Parts(205parts.com) in Kibworth , Leicestershire ? I think i need someone with 205 specific knowledge to take a look now as it seems anything but simple getting a diagnosis now. Regards Daz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
welshpug 1,627 Posted January 6, 2008 may well just be running rich and its just condensation out the back, especially if its been sat for 4 weeks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
simonb 0 Posted January 6, 2008 It is normal to get condensation after starting especially in winter as the exhaust system will be full of it for the first few minutes. Just sounds like a normal 205 GTi to me. The initial lumpyness is probably down to problems with the initial mixure or something like damp in the cylinders/ignition system. When the idle picks up it's cleared and the car should high idle OK until warmed up enough. This is a problem that these cars have always suffered with and age will simply make it worse not better. If you are sure that the Head Gasket is OK then I would start learning to live with it. This is why I never bothered installing a remote start kit on my GTi for cold mornings - could you imagine it? - ON, chug - stall - OFF, ON stall straight away, OFF - flooded... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pob 1 Posted January 7, 2008 (edited) It is normal to get condensation after starting especially in winter as the exhaust system will be full of it for the first few minutes. Just sounds like a normal 205 GTi to me. The initial lumpyness is probably down to problems with the initial mixure or something like damp in the cylinders/ignition system. When the idle picks up it's cleared and the car should high idle OK until warmed up enough. This is a problem that these cars have always suffered with and age will simply make it worse not better. If you are sure that the Head Gasket is OK then I would start learning to live with it. This is why I never bothered installing a remote start kit on my GTi for cold mornings - could you imagine it? - ON, chug - stall - OFF, ON stall straight away, OFF - flooded... Your symptoms sounds the same as mine, I have to hold the throttle slightly for about 30 seconds otherwise it will just stall. After that it clears, you can hear a change in the engine and its fine after that. Mine chucks out loads of condensation when I first start it for about a minute or so. Don't worry about it, I put it down to being a Peugeot. Saying that, I'm going to get the timing and fueling done on mine as its slightly out. Paul at 205Parts is a top bloke, give him a ring. I'm sure he will say pretty much what has been said on here though. Might be worth getting the fueling checked Dan Edited January 7, 2008 by Pob Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tesstuff 222 Posted January 7, 2008 Hey Pob thanks alot for that reply its a little lift on the situation. I went out to it today and started it up, started first time as always and no condensation at all and no low tickover, its just weird !! Might sell it before it goes wrong lol! Regards Daz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McPikie 0 Posted January 8, 2008 Its all part of owning a pug. Sounds fine to me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pob 1 Posted January 8, 2008 Hey Pob thanks alot for that reply its a little lift on the situation. I went out to it today and started it up, started first time as always and no condensation at all and no low tickover, its just weird !! Might sell it before it goes wrong lol! Regards Daz The Amount of condensation is down to weather conditions, the lead up to Christmas when it was cold, damp and misty... the amount of steam from the exhaust was ridiculous, never seen a car produce that much before, The past few days there is hardly nothing. I don't think you have nothing to worry about, Don't sell it based on this... It's a 205, they go wrong, but they are cheap and pretty easy to fix. You'll regret it, I know I did when I sold my last one. Stick with it, she sounds fine to me... Give her a wash and polish and tell her your sorry for even considering selling her. She'll forgive you and work fine Dan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McPikie 0 Posted January 8, 2008 Give her a wash and polish and tell her your sorry for even considering selling her. She'll forgive you and work fine Dan I can vouch for that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
