ORB 227 1 Cars Posted September 18, 2007 Hi guys, I am having bother again. So, the story goes, I have installed a 1.9 MI engine into the 1.6 GTi and I am running the standard 1.6/1.9 injection in the short term just to get the car running so I can hear it and make sure that the bottom end is ok ( i looked great on inspection, but I rebuilt the head) The detailed set up is 1.9 MI16 engine, plenium and throttle body Modded exhaust manifold 1.9 GTi AFM 1.9 GTi Dizzy on Constella adaptor 1.6 Brain 1.9 Injectors No SAD/Cold Start I have it all plumbed in so I can test it out before ripping it to bits to put on the R1 Carb set up in I cant get the fooker to fire though! It has fuel and spark, but no bang and go. Here is what I am thinking and what i kneed to know, - Is my Dizzy timing way out? Where about should it be? - Are my injectors on the correct Injector wires? I cant see any numbers to check? I just went with what 'looked correct' - Could it be that there is not enough oil pressure to get the rockers to jack back up as the engine has not run, thus, not allowing it to fire? Do you have any other ideas? Cheers guys. I want to get this to run so I can get on with it, the baby is due on the 7th of december, and I know that if I do not have it finished by then, I will get no time to complete it, and the car will end up sitting in the garage forever. I need to get it running to get it to paint! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jackherer 543 Posted September 18, 2007 The injectors are all wired together and fire simultaneously so plug order doesn't matter. Have you tried swinging the distributor? Spark plug order correct? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 242 3 Cars Posted September 18, 2007 Injectors on the standard jetronic system are batch fired so plug order isn't important. I think previously people with the dizzy adaptors have had to file the slots on the dizzy to get enough rotation for the timing to be right & the car to run. Not sure about the hydraulic followers, did you fill them as best you could before reassembly? If so how long has it ben stood before you tried to start it? They take quite a bit of filling if they have been stood for a while, especially if the head has been in pieces but I don't think they will stop the car from running. It'll just be very tappetty for a while. See if there is anything towards the end of this article that might help. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ORB 227 1 Cars Posted September 18, 2007 Thanks guys, always there come rain/shine and indeed, silly times of night! Glad to hear that on the Injector order, means I can forget about them Regarding the plug firing order, I think I have it correct, but I will be honest, I have no idea how to check! Is there a diagram? I am assuming that I would be best of rotating the dizzy either fully towards or fully away from me to start the car and play with it from there? but I am not sure, I plan to get computers to controll the spark when I get round to the carbs, but for now, just want to run the bugger! What would you think would be a good starting point? Also, the tappets, i will admit, since the re-build I have had it sat for about a month with them relativly dry, I squirted a bit of oil at them when i put it all back together, but not a lot more, but I would have thought that it would at least kick, so I am not sure that this is my issue? Any more input would be great! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 242 3 Cars Posted September 19, 2007 HT lead order; As for the dizzy setting, try to get it somewhere similar to how it appears in the picture below (note cap is 180' oppostieto normal) & start from there. TBH its probably going to need one person cranking & one person turning the dizzy to get it to fire though. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pugman211 0 Posted September 19, 2007 hiya not sure if i can help, but i've got 2 things on my mind. 1. Can u use a 1.6 ecu/brain on 1.9 AFM and dizzy etc????? could be a simple reason for not firing. 2. The tappets will cause u a problem, just seem something similar on my mates Elise, he had a rebuild, and the engine would turn over fine but not fire up. What we did was take all 4 plugs out of the car, and towed it round in a high gear like 3rd - 4th. This makes everything move and hence pumps the oil up to the top of the engine. Got it back, pluged the sparks back in, fired her up and she started! P.S. if it is tappets, do a comp check to reveal the score! Baz P.P.S. Congrats on baby, i also know the pressure of working on car and tryin to get ready for new baby!!!! Good luck!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ORB 227 1 Cars Posted September 19, 2007 Cool, thanks for the help, its starting to get a bit clearer now. This pic helps, but it also confuses me! You see, I am using the 1.9 Dizzy, so it is confusing, although i think the firing order is the same for the GTi, but I need a similar pic, but with the standard dizzy cap. This pic, is also a great help, i never spotted the dizzy being the wrong way round, but is it a case of the dizzy being turned or just the cap? I am not sure as I thought that the Dizzy cap would only go on one way on the dizzy? I assume you have to turn the whole unit 180? 1. Can u use a 1.6 ecu/brain on 1.9 AFM and dizzy etc????? could be a simple reason for not firing. I am not sure that this is an issue as I ran my mates 1.9 gti on a 1.6 brain for a while, so it should fire, at least enough to get it running? Or am I wrong? if so, I have a de-limited 1.9 brain in the 'stores' I hope I dont have to drag the bugger to get the pressure up as it will be a ball ache to get the timing of the plugs set correct enough to run Any other hints? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 242 3 Cars Posted September 21, 2007 On an Mi using the jetronic ecu still for fuelling I don't think it matters which ecu & dizzy combination you use as they are only there for making the spark so advance curve characteristics don't come in to effect & vac advance etc is disconnected so it should work imo with a 1.6 ecu & a 1.9 dizzy. In that picture only the cap is 180' round afaik but obviously the lead order is changed to suit. Firing order is the same, 8 or 16v. I think the dizzy could be fitted completely 180' round but the firing order still need changing. The mounting holes are opposite iirc on the dizzy body. You shouldn't need to go dragging it around to get it fired, I'd certainly leave that as an absolute last gasp attempt, if it won't start by turnign the key there must be somethign thast not right which no ammount of dragging is going to fix. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ORB 227 1 Cars Posted September 24, 2007 Holy Bugger!!!!!!!! She lives! Runs like a dream, rev's strong and ticks over like a new car. Stupid green clicky horrible bastard Relay Swapperd it for a new one (after changing injectors) and bang, she fired! Thanks boys! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
