BE3 - changing the casing

[ArthurH 12]

As below

Edited December 1, 2025 by ArthurH
Messed up the pagination

[ArthurH 12]

Just now, ArthurH said:

How we got to this point is in this topic here:

 

I need to change the casing of our BE3 gearbox

 

 

We re-shelled the race car over the last winter.  The donor car was a 1994 INCA diesel (1.8 n/A).  Although the engine was of no use to us, I noticed the gearbox looked a lot like our BE3, so I hung onto it, just in case...  Now I need it, I see it does indeed have the same 'BE3 XU' emossed into the casing - I am hoping that will make it suitable as a replacement casing - obviously all the ratios will be wrong, so I need to move the gear clusters from one to the other. (I will refer to them as the GTI and Diesel boxes)

 

I have very little knowledge of gearboxes; the last one I stripped would have been a Ford 2000E from my Mexico in the early '80s - 40 odd years ago!  So apologies for silly questions.

 

I have found on this site these two articles:

https://www.eastment.net/BE3 Gearbox Strip.htm

https://www.rallyparts.co.uk/cwp_change/

 

And I am trying to amalgamate the information/method.  Neither goes as far as stripping out the casing completely, which I guess I will need to do.  I want to give the Diesel casing a really good clean when it is 'bare'.

 

Are there any other resources I should be looking at?

 

I haven't got very far and could already do with some advice.  I'm struggling to remove the 5th gear from the output shaft.  I am aware it is very easy to chip the teeth.  Is there a 'safe' method?

 

 

 

[SRDT 231]

There is a stronger BE3R casing without the gravel hole. If you can't find a cheap Mi16 gearbox a 1.9 diesel turbo will do.

[Leslie green 158]

Is it You cant hold the gears to get the mulitpoint nut off ? if so put a cloth between the gears to jam them .

[ArthurH 12]

I have the nut off, but can't pull the gear off the shaft.

The cloth idea is clever, I'll remember that.  One of the two articles I mentioned says '...put the box in two gears at once to lock it up'.  Even although I'm past that point, it intrigues me, how exactly, would I do that?

[welshpug 1,716]

knock the roll pin out of the 5th gear selector fork, move the levers into any other gear then engage 5th by hand.

 

you'll need a puller to get the gear off.

[welshpug 1,716]

 

 

 

this might be of use

[ArthurH 12]

2 hours ago, SRDT said:

There is a stronger BE3R casing without the gravel hole. If you can't find a cheap Mi16 gearbox a 1.9 diesel turbo will do.

Thanks Baptiste, I doubt if our budget would stretch to a new gearbox to canibalise for its casing, but even if we could, it wouldn't be permitted in the Classic Stock Hatch championship.  The gearbox and internals must be standard 205GTI.

 

1 hour ago, welshpug said:

knock the roll pin out of the 5th gear selector fork, move the levers into any other gear then engage 5th by hand.

 

you'll need a puller to get the gear off.

Thanks Mei, selecting 2 gears makes sense now.  The problem I see with a standard gear puller, is the gap under the gear is only 1 or 2mm.

 

1 hour ago, welshpug said:

this might be of use

I'll have a good read of this one before I go any further.

[Tom Fenton 1,628]

If the only damage is the hole, I’d consider getting it welded up. You will spend a lot of time and effort building into another casing, all new bearings for a start, and then all the fun of buying and selecting shims to set end float. Repair your existing casing and you don’t need to do any of that. 

[ArthurH 12]

Thanks Tom, as well as the obvious hole, other cracks are surrounding it. I know each one could be welded up, but I'm concerned that we would miss something.  There is also some minor damage to the main cluster housing from before this race, so while acknowledging your suggestion, I think I will press on.

[Spesh 35 1 Cars]

Try a little heat on the 5th gear, i've struggled to get them off in the past and a wee bit of heat made them slide off.

[ArthurH 12]

Thanks Mark, I had already tried a bit, but stopped when the gearbox oil covering the gears caught fire, but I shall try a bit more.  Is it possible to pull the bearing further onto the shaft to increase the gap behind the gear?

[welshpug 1,716]

no, its tight against the rest of the gear cluster. 

[ArthurH 12]

The 5th gear in question is the one in the diesel gearbox, which I decided to strip down first.  I have removed the whole gear cluster with 5th still attached.  I can probably leave it like that unless I decide to swap any of the synchro parts (see below).

 

I have now started to strip the GTI gearbox.  Would I be correct in thinking that all the parts, except for the different-ratio 'drive' gears, are interchangeable?  I ask, as if they are, I may as well use the best bits from each gearbox.  The most obvious difference I have spotted so far, is that the selector forks are 'bronze' coloured in the diesel and black in the GTI. 

 

Also, at least 2 of the drive gears, 3 & 5th have the edges of the teeth deliberately relieved on the GTI box but not on the diesel box.  Is this somehow because of the larger diameter necessary for those specific ratios?

 

 

As the bearings on the GTI box are very good (I believe they were changed just before James bought the car), I wasn't going to dismantle the clusters; however, I may be missing an opportunity to inspect the synchro parts.  Is that at all possible with the bearings still on the cluster?

 

 

[ArthurH 12]

When I lifted the casing off the clusters, the bush and the stepped washer came off as well, and had fallen before I noticed.  Can I assume the stepped side of the washer faces the tapered bearing?

[ArthurH 12]

For the benefit of anyone reading this thread in the future, I've changed my view on the orientation of the stepped washer.  I have fitted it with the flat side towards the bearing - I think it is supposed to clamp the inner race as opposed to giving clearance to the bearing as I first thought.

 

I am setting the input bearing preload.  I have two spacers, one from each of the GTI and diesel gearboxes.  As I am measuring with a combination of imperial micrometer and digital metric vernier, I am being realistic about the accuracy of my measurements.  If I fit the diesel spacer, it will give a negative gap of 0.276mm (I assume that to be synonymous with 'preload').

 

What would be the symptoms of too much or too little preload?  I'd guess too much would heat the bearings and waste power...?  Too little - would that be noise and vibration?  How much out would be an issue?

[Leslie green 158]

I remember having the same problem with the stepped washer , cant remember which way I've fitted it but the gears wont rotate without a lot of force turning the input shaft  if its wrong . If you cant turn the input shaft by hand its the wrong way round and is jamming the bearing rollers.

I think the flat side is up , ie recess for the bearing otherwise you clamp the rollers tight through the edge of the bearing /

Edited December 10, 2025 by Leslie green

[ArthurH 12]

Leslie, you are completely correct!  I now regret having double-guessed myself and reversing the washer.  The torquing of the nuts had gone well, as had the staking and the sealing of the end cover.   But I had to do them all again to flip over the washer 

 

The symptom was as you described, the input shaft could be turned, but even in neutral it was stiff and hard to turn by hand.   With the washer stepped side towards the bearing, the input shaft is easy to turn by hand, even in any of the gears.

[Leslie green 158]

The good thing on here is somebody has probably made the same mistake before so can advise and Don't stake before checking everything turns freely as the haynes would probably say ! , it you hadn't checked those bearing would have  been shagged in no time . Its all a learning curve 

[DamirGTI 358]

Setting input shaft preload is really dicky !! 

 

At least was for me , built three with some "general purpose" industrial shims and neither was good/quiet .. third one though was less noisy , but still a bit noisy when cold .

 

So i came to the conclusion that the shims i've been using are no good , too thin and soft ..

 

Recommend buying OE pack of shims , they,re around 80 $ , 24 different shims inside ..

 

It wont go bang if you set it loose , been driving mine for 6 years , hasn't gone neither better nor worse just the noise irritates ..