205 steering racks - where from?

[rikky 37]

Anyone know any part numbers for decent brand non-pas standard 1.9 racks? Didn't QH make some a while ago? Once I find some part numbers I'm sure it'll be easy to find some aftermarket ones.

 

I think the OEM number is 400043 (lists for 1.9 GTI - unsure if square or splined though) and 400045 (doesn't mention GTI, so suspect base model)

Peugeot can't get them, GSF or ECP / LKQ can't either.

 

Just wondering what people are doing? 

Or, is there some that are compatible from another model with minimal messing around joining bits up?

Also I've seen the Quaife "quick racks" on eBay, do these fit into the existing rack housing? I don't fancy messing around in that sense but would if it was a last resort.

 

Cheers

Edited December 18, 2020 by rikky

[DamirGTI 323]

For the square drive , non pas rack OE part No. is - 400042

 

"Sasic" does them , i see two on stock from where i buy spare parts ... also available from "TRW" , "Spidan" and some other mainly Italian aftermarket brands .

 

However i do have to note that some of the aftermarket steering racks i've seen are , really poor .. aftermarket Italian made especially ("General Ricamb" , "Stamat" ...) , i had one of those for the 205 and the quality was crap lasted only 2-3 years , and the rack mechanism had even more lock-to-lock turns than the OE item (around 4 or even 4.2 turns if i remember ..) .

 

What's wrong with you're OE rack ? as there's rebuild kit available if that's the problem with play/knocking .

 

If not repairing/rebuilding your current OE rack , personally id avoid all the new aftermarket ones , better to find good used one .. from 306/ZX/Xsara or vans  C15/partner/berlingo , most of them will be pas racks but can use them like manual racks without pas will just need to fit 205 track rods on .. as a bonus , pas rack will be slightly quicker than the non pas ones (3.2 turns for pas rack and 3.8 for manual) .

 

D

 

 

Edited December 18, 2020 by DamirGTI

[rikky 37]

400042 is a LHD rack by the way! It's a RHD one I'm after for a late/square drive 205 GTI, should have mentioned!

RE: rebuild kit, I can't find that either, I have asked 4 different suppliers now and nobody can find it.

I'm sure a couple of the smaller individual parts are available but a lot are NFP and no stock.

The rubber bellows/boots covering the rack on mine are split and grease looks to be leaking from somewhere so I was going to just buy a new one rather than mess about disassembling mine with a million parts!

Are the racks interchangeable then? I'd have to remove bits like the drive off mine wouldn't I if using a 306 one? And would using a PAS rack dry be ok for non-pas vehicle?

 

Edited December 18, 2020 by rikky

[DamirGTI 323]

Yes , that's what we use over here !

 

Good used OE rack from one of the cars i mentioned above would be best and is what i personally would do .. there's still quite a few 306's and Xsara's around as well as Mk1 Partner/Berlingo vans so finding some private or at the scrappy shouldn't be problematic nor expensive .

 

D

Edited December 18, 2020 by DamirGTI

[rikky 37]

I'm just looking around, looks like a few people have a 306 GTi6 rack fitted, which looks like direct fit, unsure about the steering joint though.. needs to be looked into!

 

Thanks for the reply

[DamirGTI 323]

Xsara VTS pas rack is best , that's if you can find one ... they're the quickest , 2.4 turns for Mk1 VTS and 2.6 for Mk2 .

 

I have the 2.4 one on my daily 205 and it's simply amazing , would never ever go back to manual 3.8 rack .. with these "quick ones" you really must use them with pas , so fit all the hydraulics pump lines etc. , using them like manual racks is painfully and hard !

 

Apart from the Xsara VTS , one of the 2.6 quick racks can be also found on ZX 2.0 16V .. and that one from ZX is spline drive , Xsara ones are square . 

 

 

D

 

 

[welshpug 1,621]

Autodoc list bushes for 205 racks.

[welshpug 1,621]

zx is 2.4 turn I'm sure.

[SRDT 146]

You can find 3 pas racks on the ZX:

Non sport petrol and diesel : 3 tr 1/3 green cap 7 teeth pinion

Sport petrol : 2 tr 3/4 black cap 8 teeth pinion

16v : 2 tr 1/2 yellow cap 9 teeth pinion

 

As for the 306 GTI6 it isn't as quick as the ZX one and if you want to use it as a pas rack you need to change the ram.

[jord294 87]

2 hours ago, rikky said:

400042 is a LHD rack by the way! It's a RHD one I'm after for a late/square drive 205 GTI, should have mentioned!

RE: rebuild kit, I can't find that either, I have asked 4 different suppliers now and nobody can find it.

I'm sure a couple of the smaller individual parts are available but a lot are NFP and no stock.

The rubber bellows/boots covering the rack on mine are split and grease looks to be leaking from somewhere so I was going to just buy a new one rather than mess about disassembling mine with a million parts!

Are the racks interchangeable then? I'd have to remove bits like the drive off mine wouldn't I if using a 306 one? And would using a PAS rack dry be ok for non-pas vehicle?

 

Got a decent 2nd hand one here

[rikky 37]

It looks like I’m going to have to source the bushes / bearings and rebuild this one. However, I was contemplating the Quaife quick rack. 
 

But, there seems to be serious problems obtaining the right bush for the pinion and it isn’t supplied with it, nowhere make one, and Quaife don’t supply it.

 

anyone with a Quaife quick rack successfully sourced or can provide the bush for it? 

 

[SRDT 146]

Does the Quaife rack needs a standard bush or an off-center one like the Gr.A PTS rack?

[rikky 37]

I'm not sure, I just know they are hard/impossible to get off the shelf, looks like I need:

ID 19mm
OD 35mm
Depth 10mm

.. but nowhere makes them. Big thread here about it

[welshpug 1,621]

thats not a bush being discussed, its the pinion bearing.

[rikky 37]

3 minutes ago, welshpug said:

thats not a bush being discussed, its the pinion bearing.

Yes my mistake. Either way nobody seems to actually have them, and resort to removing existing ones off an old pinion which sounds like a terrible state of affairs.

On AutoDoc I found the "repair kit" for the housing itself, which looks like two seals and the plastic thing (item 3 in the diagram above). But I'd still need the Circlip and the two washers from the diagram. 

Basically, if I'm dismantling the whole rack, I might as well put the Quaife quick rack in there but it's proving to be a pain finding the right bits or what people have done if they've used it with a bearing.

[welshpug 1,621]

I've never seen anyone post a bearing number off one, its a specific one to psa (possibly zf)   not a standard bearing.

 

if a 17mm bearing will clear the square drive I'd look to getting the shaft diameter reduced.

[SRDT 146]

4 hours ago, rikky said:

I'm not sure, I just know they are hard/impossible to get off the shelf, looks like I need:

ID 19mm
OD 35mm
Depth 10mm
 

 

Is it 19mm or 3/4" (19.05mm)?

The depth is 11mm but otherwise that's what you need:

https://bearingsdirect.com/ball-bearings/metric-sizes-ball-bearing/6200-series-light-duty-c3-emq/6202-2rs-34-odd-size-ball-bearing-3-4x35x11-sealed-ubc

[rikky 37]

Is it a ball bearing one then like that? I'm yet to dismantle it so don't know for sure. There seemed to be a lot of bearing types when I attempted to search earlier   (deep groove, self aligning, insert, etc)

 

Someone on a previous thread measured the pinion at 19.05 too, which would make sense to be 3/4" imperial size.

(this one here: 

 

Anyway, I shall take a look at your link and see what's what. I wonder if it's available in UK somewhere, looks to be a US site? I'll do some investigating.

Edited December 21, 2020 by rikky

[rikky 37]

I assume the bearing is the thicker part half way up the splined/square drive shaft in this diagram? eg, not available separately?

 

Looks like I also need other bits in this diagram too, to do a proper 'rebuild', so parts 6 and 7 on the left side (and part 7 lists two potential parts), and part 8 on the right side. I haven't seen these in any 'rebuild kit' available though. Until I pull it apart I guess I don't know what I'm up against but the idea is to do it without having to stop and source more bits  

Edited December 21, 2020 by rikky

[welshpug 1,621]

yes that would be the bearing on the pinion pictured

[DamirGTI 323]

It's the rack "bearing" which fails and needs replacing from time to time .. item No. 4006 09 , it's not the actual metal bearing but plastic (Teflon plastic i guess) bush with two rubber rings .

 

That and the rack boots , the rest of the stuff on the rack rarely/mostly never goes bad ...

 

 

D

[rikky 37]

I know, it's just that the metal pinion bearing coincides with changing the rack from std to a quick rack whilst I have it apart 

Basically, they are impossible to source over here. Some American sites list them. The problem is the inner diameter is imperial 3/4" (aka 19.05mm) so people can't find a 19mm bearing because they aren't made. But 19.05 ones are. But they're non-existent over here in UK.

 

I might just leave the damn thing and put new boots on it and be done with it.
 

[dale205mills 39 7 Cars]

take a look at my thread of rebuilding my white 205 and you will see my rebuilt rack. I brought a quaife quick rack from spooks and I went to my local bearing place and they couldnt match the bearing as it is a funny size and I guess you would of seen this in past threads but they did contact there supplier ho could of made the bearing for me with a order of 5 at £30 pound each and I ended up pressing out the old bearing and re useing that. I have had a chat with miles at pugracing about rebuilt steering racks and he said I would find the inner parts on mister-auto.co.uk and the other bits like tie rods and rubbers from ebay or local part supplier all together my sterring rack cost me about 300 to 350 due to buying the quick rack with out that it wouldnt be to exspensive, sorry if I have talked on but that is how I rebuilt mine.

[rikky 37]

Thanks!

 

I’m trying to get the right bearing as we speak. 
 

I’ve got the inner tie rods in order, new TRE’s, and I’ve got the boots ordered.

 

I need to get the “bush kit” (plastic bit and two seals) (400609) and I think that will do. 
 

I should be in a position then to either fit a Quaife quick rack or put an original rack back together. I think the other bronze bit that comes with the Quaife quick racks replaced the plastic part that the pinion locates in. 
 

Aside from that, there’s a stopper and some washers in the diagrams above, but they should be reusable. 

Edited December 21, 2020 by rikky

[rikky 37]

hang on..

 

just been measuring my OEM bearing on the pinion..

 

this original pinion bearing, aren't we overlooking that the outer diameter of the bearing *could be* 1.375", aka 34.925mm? It seems to be ever so slightly under 35mm when I check my OEM one.

 

So it would mean it's an entirely imperial bearing, 1.375" outer, and utilising the 3/4" internal diameter, no? And the confusion for so long is actually this?

 

Also, the depth of the bearing seems to be 10mm, so could this be 3/8" imperial aka 9.525mm? or 7/16mm aka 11.11mm (possibly too big, but might actually work) I can't see either one of these making a substantial difference either good or bad to either application, as there's plenty of space in the rack housing to seat the bearing.

 

Just a thought? Anyone care to chime in?

 

I have absolutely every single part took off the OEM rack, including the drawn cup bearing on the base of the pinion which I'll be replacing, along with every other part in there, and I'll get some proper photos when I fit my quick rack and reassemble it.

Edited December 23, 2020 by rikky