Avo Adjustables Just Been Fitted....

[Guest shredmaster73]

I agree with Dave, Toyo's are the best tyres for the money. By the way, just how much did you pay for your Avo's ? If you don't mind me asking.

[Guest Nathanlgd]

Wow! those Toyos are cheap! I always thought they'd cost around £80 each or somethin, think I better order a set

[Deadliest Pug 0]

The Toyos are cheap, but on my 405 I went through a whole set in 10,000 miles of reasonably hard road driving.

 

The Eagles were more expensive but are going much better and are better in the wet, not as noisy (As in they don't squeal like banshees when you corner) and seem to have better feel.

 

Although whenever you get new tyres you are going from old to freshso these observations are again very subjective.

 

Dave!

[Adi 0]

Toyo Proxes are a floppy tyre (got 2 off rims in my garage and you can squash the tyre really easily) and this is probably where the slight numbness comes from. Bridgestone Potenza SO2s are massively stiffer, so much so that the tyre fitter usually complains about them!!! lol

 

Funny I would say exactly the opposite.

 

The Eagle F1 GSD2 had soft sidewalls......which let the dry handling down. It was almost possible to drive the tyres off the rim they would tuck under that easily.

 

Now the Toyo has a hard sidewall in comparison.......which is why it is often said that compared to the GSD2......the Toyo was better in the dry. Also the handling balance on the GSD2 was poor with more understeer especially on a FWD. With the Toyo.....the balance was far better with the rear becoming quite nervous in the wet........another sign of the stiffer sidewalls. On an Elise the Toyo proved not very good......as it made an oversteering car...even more nervous.

 

I have no personal experience of the S0-2......but the reports that I've read have mentioned the gentle break away point due to the softer sidewalls.

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

Funny I would say exactly the opposite.

 

The Eagle F1 GSD2 had soft sidewalls......which let the dry handling down. It was almost possible to drive the tyres off the rim they would tuck under that easily.

 

Now the Toyo has a hard sidewall in comparison.......which is why it is often said that compared to the GSD2......the Toyo was better in the dry. Also the handling balance on the GSD2 was poor with more understeer especially on a FWD. With the Toyo.....the balance was far better with the rear becoming quite nervous in the wet........another sign of the stiffer sidewalls. On an Elise the Toyo proved not very good......as it made an oversteering car...even more nervous.

 

I have no personal experience of the S0-2......but the reports that I've read have mentioned the gentle break away point due to the softer sidewalls.

Yes the GSD2 has soft sidewalls compared to the GSD3/Toyo.

 

The S02 does have stiffer sidewalls, I know that there is a "issue" with the tyres and it always seems to be for Porsche 911s etc using these tyres; there is actually a different S02 for this car and similar cars.

[Guest Nathanlgd]

Gunna buy the Toyos anyway - cant complain for £32 a tyre!!

[Pugnut 9 1 Cars]

this my personal opinion ,

 

if you are going to uprate your suspension you should make sure that all the existing components are in tip top condition before you start .

 

bottom arms , bushes, balljoints . get the tracking checked . check your rear beam for play . wheelbearings ect . top mounts often get overlooked . anti roll bar drop links .

 

have you experimented with tyre pressures? experiment with the pressures , front and rear .

 

i've had tyres before that have had soft tyrewalls and adding a couple of extra psi has a made difference and really sharpened up the handling .

 

it can be surpising how much you can improve the cars handling by playing with tyre pressures. and the best bit is that it's free !!

 

personally i try starting at 28psi and work upwards. it depend on the tyre but i normally run between 29 and 32 psi .

 

do you have a tyre pressure gauge ? very cheap . i never trust gauges at garages.

[Guest Nathanlgd]

I have a tyre pressure guage and I'm running 29Psi all round.

[Guest cholo777]

hi guys,been reading through these posts and you seem pretty knowledgeable about tyres,suspension and setups,maybe you can best advise me as i have little idea and am finding it difficult finding a mechanic that wants to tackle my car,lol,

 

its a 205 with a gti-6 engine dropped in,suspension was ok initially but it did not stay like that for long,got really hard after a month,decided after talking to a few people to go for the vsx spax kit,bad choice,felt ok for about a week and then got hard,i now have bilstein sprintline kit with non genuine standard springs,i thought if i raised the front a little,i would have damping and a more comfortable ride,u can hardly press down on the front of the car,scarey,the front is higher than the rear by about 40 or 50 mm,i try not to look at it 4 too long,because it is probably more than 50mm,i am in denial,but suspension is awful and i need to do something else,please please advise,car has so much potential but suspension needs attention,any help would be much appreciated..i have f1's all round..only thing keeping me on the road,lol,

regs

paul

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

How does the ride get harder after a while

 

I think you just need a set of good quality lowering springs, like Eibach or Skip Brown springs.

 

What are your shock absorbers, and if they are adjustable what are they set to?

[Guest cholo777]

How does the ride get harder after a while

 

I think you just need a set of good quality lowering springs, like Eibach or Skip Brown springs.

 

What are your shock absorbers, and if they are adjustable what are they set to?

hi mate,honestly ride did get harder,dampers currently on the car are bilstein sprintline all round,with standard 1.9 springs,car is higher at the front,lol,and it is really hard as i described earlier,dont have adjustables,i was considering putting the billy springs on 30mm drop to level car out but i imagine the ride will be just as hard,if there is a better solution i would appreciate your advice,you mentioned eibach,do you think this would be the better way to go,is there a code for them,i did read in another post about a progressive eibach 205 spring,dont know what this means but i would really like a more comfortable ride if it can be achieved,thanks for your reply,i appreciate it,

regs

paul

[Pugnut 9 1 Cars]

if the sprintlines are a shortened strut which i think they are , and you arev using standard springs ten this will ruin your shock absorbers and give a very harsh ride .

 

personally i cant rate the eibach springs highly enough . with a heavy front end like yours the 30mm drop will probably be more like 40 and should work well with a shortened damper .

 

thats my take on it but i'm by no means an expert .

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

I'm surprised your finding the standard springs are not giving much suspension.

 

A progessive spring is just that progressively get stronger the more they are compressed so it rides better. The SBC springs are progressive I think and much cheaper than the Eibachs (that can be the top end of the scale).

[Guest cholo777]

I'm surprised your finding the standard springs are not giving much suspension.

 

A progessive spring is just that progressively get stronger the more they are compressed so it rides better. The SBC springs are progressive I think and much cheaper than the Eibachs (that can be the top end of the scale).

seriously there is no suspension,can hardly press the front down,a few have tried and looked a little bit sorry 4 me,not heard of SBC,are the sprintline dampers shortened struts like the chap above mentioned,are progressive springs better for me given what i have,thanx for taking the time here to put me right as i know didly about suspensions,,apart from knowing the front end of the car cant be right,

regs

paul

[Guest cholo777]

if the sprintlines are a shortened strut which i think they are , and you arev using standard springs ten this will ruin your shock absorbers and give a very harsh ride .

 

personally i cant rate the eibach springs highly enough . with a heavy front end like yours the 30mm drop will probably be more like 40 and should work well with a shortened damper .

 

thats my take on it but i'm by no means an expert .

cheers for the input m8,r u sure they are a shortened damper and the standard springs are compromising the suspension,would really like to resolve this,i deserve a more comfortable ride,lol,

regs

paul

[Pugnut 9 1 Cars]

i'm not sure if they are shortened but i think i've read on this forum that they are .

 

with shortened struts and standard springs the damper will be operating at the top of its limits , meaning when the spring damper wants to extend it will just crash against the top of the strut body .this will give a harsh ride and wreck your suspension .

 

i'm no expert . what to do is click on Adi's username then click 'find all posts by this member' you will be seriously enlightened .

 

to quote adi:

 

Posted on: Oct 16 2003, 05:23 PM

 

 

Is the Sprintline shock still a short stroke damper??

 

 

 

Yes the Sprint is a short stroke damper.

 

If the standard springs that come with the Sprintline kit are only -25mm.....then I guess that would mean that the GTI is around 15mm lower than standard.

 

Add those figures together and you get the -40mm normally associated with the Sprintline kit.

 

from : this topic

[Adi 0]

i now have bilstein sprintline kit with non genuine standard springs

 

Last time Paul and I spoke........he had the Bilstein Streetline kit with std springs, and not the Sprintline kit. Not sure whether anything has changed since then.

[Guest cholo777]

Last time Paul and I spoke........he had the Bilstein Streetline kit with std springs, and not the Sprintline kit. Not sure whether anything has changed since then.

my mistake adi,just before reading your post i was looking through all my receipts for the car,i have quite a few,lol,and it is the streetline kit,adi i am still trying to find a good setup on the car,still have my wobbles at the front end aswell,so not alot has changed,as you have probably gathered from messages above i dont have any damping on the front of the car,so i feel everything through the front end,dont know what to try next,not happy with the car sitting higher at the front in relation to the rear and going higher has not helped,maybe standard dampers with those eibach springs,if you think there's another solution i would be all ears,,and i apologise tp pugnut and c_w for giving them the wrong information,what was i thinking of,cheers for your help adi.

regs

paul

[Adi 0]

seriously there is no suspension,can hardly press the front down

 

i dont have any damping on the front of the car,so i feel everything through the front end,

 

 

What you are describing in the first quote.......is the damper being too highly rated, not too low. Though to be honest......the Streetline dampers are only 10% uprated on std dampers.........and should have plenty of movement in them. There may be a slight "nose" force on the damper......which means it takes a little more force to actually get the damper moving to start off with. But I wasn't aware of this fact with that particular damper.

 

maybe standard dampers with those eibach springs

 

To be honest now you have tried my original suggestion......the std springs......and that hasn't improved things........I really can't see anything working along the lines of either spring or damper. You have gone from Spax which are known for their poor ride quality.....to std springs and Bilstein Streetline damper.......and you can't really get more comfortable. Those Bilsteins provide a better ride than the Peugeot dampers.

If the problem hasn't disappeared with that set up......it never will do whilst changing springs/damper.

 

Are you still using the std GTI Speedline wheels........or have you gone back to the split rims with spacers????

[Guest cholo777]

What you are describing in the first quote.......is the damper being too highly rated, not too low. Though to be honest......the Streetline dampers are only 10% uprated on std dampers.........and should have plenty of movement in them. There may be a slight "nose" force on the damper......which means it takes a little more force to actually get the damper moving to start off with. But I wasn't aware of this fact with that particular damper.

 

 

 

To be honest now you have tried my original suggestion......the std springs......and that hasn't improved things........I really can't see anything working along the lines of either spring or damper. You have gone from Spax which are known for their poor ride quality.....to std springs and Bilstein Streetline damper.......and you can't really get more comfortable. Those Bilsteins provide a better ride than the Peugeot dampers.

If the problem hasn't disappeared with that set up......it never will do whilst changing springs/damper.

 

Are you still using the std GTI Speedline wheels........or have you gone back to the split rims with spacers????

hi adi,cheers for your response m8,i have changed wheels,no longer have spacers,had those compotives with spacers originally but thought that would be a good idea to change them,i now have 1.9 speedlines "15's"as they will go over the big brakes,dont look too bad either but suspension is still a concern,tyres are 195x50x15's f1 eagles,its not comfortable and the front looks higher than the rear,wouldent mind so much if it improved things,i was thinking about putting the streetline springs on to level the car out but going lower will make things worse i think,buggared if i know what to do,just really acts up on an uneven surface,also picked up a wobble at the front when i decrease speed or on a bad surface,and a popping n/s/f when i pull away or brake or steer excessively,i could understand all this if i abused the car but i drive like an old man,lol,bad luck or what,

regs

paul

[Adi 0]

i was thinking about putting the streetline springs on to level the car out but going lower will make things worse

 

If it makes the car look better......then I doubt very much it will cause any probs.

 

Since you've had probs with the front suspension and ride quality......I think you have just about changed everything (struts,springs,lower wishbones,drop links, roll bar bushes).......and not really got near been happy with it.

As I said before......the suspension has been softened a massive amount.....and still you aren't happy with the ride quality.....which leads me to believe there is either an underlying prob which has little to do with the basic suspension.....or you are wanting something that isn't possible from the car.

 

Before the GTI-6 engine was dropped in.......did you drive the car for very long? and how did you find the suspension/ride quality????

 

Have you driven any other 205GTI and been happy with the ride quality???? Maybe you should try and drive a std GTI and see what you think.

[Pugnut 9 1 Cars]

have you checked your subframe mounting bolts ?

 

i know its a long shot but you really are running out of ideas.

[Guest cholo777]

If it makes the car look better......then I doubt very much it will cause any probs.

 

Since you've had probs with the front suspension and ride quality......I think you have just about changed everything (struts,springs,lower wishbones,drop links, roll bar bushes).......and not really got near been happy with it.

As I said before......the suspension has been softened a massive amount.....and still you aren't happy with the ride quality.....which leads me to believe there is either an underlying prob which has little to do with the basic suspension.....or you are wanting something that isn't possible from the car.

 

Before the GTI-6 engine was dropped in.......did you drive the car for very long? and how did you find the suspension/ride quality????

 

Have you driven any other 205GTI and been happy with the ride quality???? Maybe you should try and drive a std GTI and see what you think.

adi believe me when i say the suspension is really harsh,before the conversion i drove the car for about 5 months and the suspension was great,no problems whatsoever,i have had 4 more 205 gti's and they have all been fine,no complaints,i am very familar with them as you can see,but this 1 is completely different,its definitely not right,as you said earlier it must be something other than the suspension which is at fault,i do believe you when you say i have the most comfortable setup on the car,only conclusion i can reach is something else is undermining the suspension,it would be nice to know what it is,i do really appreciate your help with this,its a pity you couldent drive it and then you would empathise with me completely,got to be something really stupid,lol,talk to you soon.

regs

paul

[Guest cholo777]

have you checked your subframe mounting bolts ?

 

i know its a long shot but you really are running out of ideas.

i dont mind you having a suggestion,never know you could be right,lol,adi has helped me with the suspension,its been ongoing for sometime so i do understand why he is a little bit perplexed with me but i am being straight up,its hard finding a mechanic where i am that would know all these things,yet to find 1,must be 1 in norfolk,cheers again for the suggestion

regs

paul

 

ps..my bedtime,early start.