Quintet Insert Fabric

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi all,

I have today sold the last of my replica material called Quintet. It has taken nearly 2 years for it all to go and the day I thought was so far away has finally arrived. I realised quite early on that I needed to find an alternate manufacturer, this was confirmed when there was a management change at the Turkish auto weavers that I used in the first place. My endeavours whilst lengthy, have proved unsuccessful. Nobody is interested in weaving small batches of fabric either in the UK, Europe or the Far East. So where does that leave the GTi owner who is trying to "maintain the marque"? Well, over the last few years I have kept a close eye on my opposition (so to speak) and a number of contenders have emerged in the last 12-18 months.

 

For the Ramier fabric, C.T.A.I - Istres offer the best replica fabric - I reported on this a while back, but it's expensive.

 

For Quartet ,the most likely alternative is a fabric produced by a member of the French 205 GTi club de France (see enclosed picky). I have been in touch with him and have obtained a sample of the red/black version. This is a good reproduction in a 2 ply chenille thread. There is no foam/scrim back ( at least not on the sample I got) and it looks good. The 205 club will sell to non members at 65 euros per metre plus 15 euros for shipping - presumably within the EU only at that price. This product does seem to have some teething problems though and deliveries for orders taken before Xmas (Nov 13) haven't all been met yet. I would advise that members here wait and see for a while. They are also promising Biarritz as well, but I think they are having problems with the dyeing of the yarn.

 

The French "Quartet"

I have a copy of their order form (an .xls file) for those of you who are interested.

regards

Dave

Edited March 10, 2014 by dch1950

[cRaig 265 1 Cars]

Interesting to see how the field of suitable fabrics is developing over the years. Has the chap in France had any other colours of the "Quartet" made?

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi Craig,
Yes he has - allegedly, blue and green - I've been trying to get samples from him but he has gone all quiet on me.
It'll be interesting to see how this pans out. They will only sell by the metre and say it takes 2 metres (minimum) for all 4 seats. I know that's wrong as it's 1.5 metres - but will those little Frenchmen listen to DCH . Still we'll see

Dave

PS I'd like to do a deal with him - but I'm not going to hold my breath,

Edited March 10, 2014 by dch1950

[Rjuhar 52]

Can you post any link for the Biaritz theme pls...

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi all,

I thought this post might raise some interest. I have received confirmation from Stephan Remy (of Atelier 148) that he has sent me green and blue samples of the Quartet so I should have those this week and will post here asap.

From what I can see the production and distribution is a little muddled. There is one guy on the French forum who is the actual manufacturer, or claims to be, then there are 2 club members who seem to answer most questions about production and distribution. A third component in the saga,Atelier 148, is a trim shop that I got to know about when they asked for samples of my Quintet" about 18 months ago, and they seem to be acting as agents for distribution ( they advertise this material under there own name on Leboncoin and other French sale sites). When I asked to do a deal for bulk purchase of the fabric they went quiet and said they couldn't do it. The problem I have with this material is that I know how much it costs to make and would like to strike a deal with the manufacturer ( whoever he actually is because we only ever know him by his forum handle - cagey these French guys). I emailed him yesterday and will have to wait and see on that. Every French supplier I have contacted seems reluctant to do business on a reasonable basis - by that I mean give me a reasonable trade discount.

I am happy to get this material imported to use in my own seat covers but I'm not paying between 65 and 75 Euros per running metre to get it.Still I await the results of my recent enquiries.

regards

Dave

PS Gregor, Hi - No direct link - but just join the French forum as I did (and a few others on this forum) and have a look for your self.

D

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

This is another (less blurred) view of the red Quartet. It was advertised by Atelier 148 last year at 59 euros per metre. When I asked for some I got an initial confirmation, which was then withdrawn. I thought this was a bit odd as when I asked if he was able to sell the material separately to the "Club de France" he said yes - he could sell to who he liked. Clearly he couldn't. This picky is a bit over exposed but it does show the nature of the Chenille thread ( known as hairy caterpillar in French).

 

regards

Dave

[2052NV 24]

wicked thanks for putting in all the reaserch and trying to deal with the french for us. I would be very keen on some fabric once cleared up

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi,
"Deal with the French" - yes well- that sums up the difficulty really. Unless the manufacturer will 1) actually talk to me and 2) if he is prepared to do a reasonable deal with me, then all "Quartet" look alike fabric will have to be purchased through the "Club de France at the prices I've indicated. Joining the forum is free, but joining the Club isn't (and it's not cheap and is so full of regulations and caveats). They say it's available to non-members ( forum or Club - not quite certain about this) and charge an extra 10 euros per metre though if you aren't (a member).
Orders were taken (paid in full - in advance) starting around November last year but I don't think anybody has actually got any (Quartet) yet. If they had, you'd see a load of posts along the lines of " here's my re-trimmed GTi, remarkable by their absence thus far.
The forum member who seems to be handling it for the "Club" is reporting the end of March for delivery of the Quartet and continuing problems with dyeing the yarn for the Biarritz (it's too thin and the dye won't take).
Just have to be patient I suppose as these guys just drift along in there own little world, safe in the knowledge that approval by the "Restoration Committee" guarantees their market and thus sales. Exactly the same thing happened with the 1.6 bolster cloth - I reported on this years ago.
regards
Dave
PS 26th August 1346 is the critical date

D

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi all,

just got my post, and Stephan has come up with samples and a picture as well. So here's the green and blue versions of the Club de France recommended "quartet" replacement fabric.

 

The hairy caterpillar strikes again.

 

regards

Dave

 

PS I have now tracked down the manufacturer.

[Edp 67 3 Cars]

Nice to see some green Dave! ????

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

To be honest I don't think any of the colours are particularly good. The red is too "pillar box", the green is vey wishy-washy compared to the original, and the blue isn't even close. We also have the problem that this fabric isn't flame laminated (as mine was and should be) and so will stretch and lose it's shape quite easily. I can get that done in the UK for about £2 per metre, but I would need to send rolls of this material - not single metres, and for a material already costing 65 euros per running metre (red only) this isn't very cost effective (yet !).The green and blue are an extra 10 euros per metre i.e. 75 euros per metre.

This is for non-forum members (of the 205 GTi club de France).

I also discovered that the manufacturer is a firm called "Muguet" an auto textile firm. That explains the presence of a forum member "Muguet" on the French forum itself. When I PM'd this member it turns out to be one Claudia Landrock (a commercial assistant of Muguet S.A. (France))

She tells me I can't buy direct from the manufacturer as they have a commercial exclusivity agreement with Stephan Remy (of Atelier 148). The guy who told me last year he couldn't sell to me. Curious fellow. This exclusivity being to sales outside the French mainland. I always knew being part of the EU would be a benefit . Atelier 148's price (before Xmas) was 59 euros per metre but I think that will go up in line with the figures I just quoted you. They haven't wear tested this fabric yet either - they just quote the figures for chenille fabrics, used for candlewick bedspreads if you don't know what it is.

I've done my best thus far, but unless I can get a sensible discount out of M. Remy then it isn't going to make me any money to use it. Either that or I have to up my prices.

That's where I'm at, as of yesterday.

regards

Dave

Edited March 15, 2014 by dch1950

[Slo 283 1 Cars]

The original fabric red strips are plastic/plastic backed suede effect aren't they? At least that's what it looks like to me, certainly isn't cotton/vinyl anyway

[mhyphenl 10 1 Cars]

Was it impossible to get this stuff made or was it that they were asking for numbers too large at this stage. If you waded in with an order of 10000 meters would you find it easier to source?

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

you lend me the money and I'll happily do that. 65 x 10,000 = ....

Dave

PS what would we do with the remaining 9,900 metres though ?

D

Edited March 15, 2014 by dch1950

[mhyphenl 10 1 Cars]

Hi Dave,

 

It wasn't really a suggestion, just trying to ascertain whether it's a volume issue or an in capability on the weavers part! 10,000 was plucked out of thin air but surely the costings weren't in the region of £65 a meter at quantity! I'm wondering whether investment or pooling of resources may get us nearer the mark! Take the French on at their own game and maybe even surpass the quality of their weave!

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

I think I've been attempting to do that for the last 2 + years. However it would seem that most of my efforts seem to have gone un-noticed.

Of course it doesn't cost 65 Euros to produce, in exactly the same way that the black needle cord they sell at 55 euros doesn't cost that either. I am well up to date with the price breakdown.

This is history as far as I'm concerned as I have already pointed this out to this forum in numerous threads on the this subject. I produced Quintet 12 months before them and I did produce a superior (to the OEM) fabric.Trouble is I have run out of it (see the beginning of this thread) and my attempts to find another supplier over the last 12 months have proved fruitless. The French are "Johnny come latelys" from my point of view.

Pooling of resources as you put it is not feasible for this forum - it's not a legal entity merely an informal un-official association/group with a shared interest. The French Club actually has a legal identity and structure. You can see for yourself how the various efforts at producing some of the rarer components by dedicated forum members has panned out. Tooling costs nearly always kill them stone dead. So it is with fabrics. You will never get a textile manufacturer to produce small batches of any product - I think I was lucky with Luksteks, but once they realised I wasn't going to buy 100's of metres from them they turned the tap off. Hence the need to find an alternative material for our cars. In general this boils down to finding a textile manufacturer, not necessarily auto fabric, who has prototyping facilities and looms - they are the ones who can produce small custom batches. I thought I had found one in Otley last month but they looked at my Quintet and said it was not suitable for their looms. Different looms for different fabrics you see.

I should also make it clear I have no association with the French club's product, with Muguet or Atelier 148 and thus can't answer questions about their fabric ,it's price, or it's availability. So please do not attempt to do so.

regards

Dave

PS all French prices are in Euros - not GBP

D

Edited March 16, 2014 by dch1950

[welshpug 1,622]

have you thought of asking the PSCUK?

[mhyphenl 10 1 Cars]

Clearly no company is going to want to set up their equipment, sorce thread etc for small amounts if it doesn't look likely you're going to make that order for hundreds if meters. I guess it comes down to how many of the finished product, ie complete seat covers, you feel you are likely to sell and the level of Capitol you can put to that expectation.

From my point if view I'm waiting on a complete product before I refresh my seats as its less of a fiddle to do it all in In one and I think that's why this subject always attracts so much attention, people are very interested in your ability to do the complete article.

I think you huge efforts so far and level of detail are testament to the quality of the finished products you already have but I do think you'll witness a sizeable increase in customers when the quintet saga is sorted!

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Tell me something new that I don't already know . You clearly don't understand the nature of this project - producing full covers is relatively easy - it involves straight line sewing and requires very little "ability". The delaying factor has been the construction sewing of the bolsters and I have at times put myself on the public rack that is this forum by detailing my failed attempts to perfect that process over the years. Equally my acknowledgement that at best I'm an average ability sewing machinist was something of a personal road to Damascus. The adaptation of one's aims to meet one's requirements is the real ability as far as I'm concerned. I don't care how long it takes - but I am coming good on my promises - so I hope you won't have to wait much longer. The insert fabric will be an on going saga and I think that it won't be resolved quickly.

As I've already stated in this thread - If I can't buy the French material on a wholesale basis ,with the foam backing that I think is vital, then full replacement GTi covers with Quartet inserts are not viable as a product range for me. That leaves the owners (myself included) with the repair option or replace completely with different style/make of seats. Thus waiting whilst may be prudent for you but will neither help or hinder my own plans. Thanks for your well considered input though.

best regards

Dave

 

best regards

Dave

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi all,

In an effort to resolve my supply chain difficulties concerning the "Quartet" replica material I have asked to be considered as a UK agent for the distribution of this fabric. No response so far.

I am happy to sew up full cover sets using 3rd party customer purchased insert materials e.g. the Ramier replica from ASCI, the Muguet "Quartet" etc.

I will not buy them directly for incorporation into my seat covers unless the manufacturer will give me trade prices. If I have to pay retail prices then my prices will go up accordingly. I think this is an unreasonable proposition for my potential customers. Bear in mind though that I don't think that the Muguet "quartet" works without a foam laminated backing to keep the fabric shape when fitted and getting it retro fitted to single metre(s) lengths is not practical. We'll have to wait and see how things pan out.

regards

Dave

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi all,

Very little progress on this so far. No response from Claudia Landrock of Muguet and I doubt if she will. Typical French - the usual take it or leave it - I have spoken , all resistance is futile etc.,etc. . The Chinese (out of Shanghai) are really helpful and attentive though; and they wonder why their market share is dropping.

Atelier 148 being the only source for non- French , non forum members. He rarely replies to any emails ( if you find his email address) let alone orders. He has no site or shop but he is on Twatter, and F-book. Ah that's modern marketing for you, I suppose. You kids ,what are you like with your new fangled Wi-Fi (easily hacked) tablets and 4G smart phones.

(Note to self - stop this right now Dave)

If any thing changes I'll keep you all informed.

regards

Dave

Edited March 21, 2014 by dch1950

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Just a final note on this topic - I can't elicit a reply from either Atelier 148's Stephan REMY, or Muguet's - Claudia Landrock. Pig ignorance in my view. I repeat what I've said before, this is the only alternative (Quartet) material around at the moment and it's not without it's problems. No foam backing - so it loses shape very easily when fitted, It's too expensive and the so called Europe and the rest of the world agent isn't interested in anything related to it - e.g. marketing, and selling it. I've done my bit here and can't be bothered with people who just ignore my reasonable requests. Thus I leave this to be picked up by someone else.

best regards

Dave

 

[2052NV 24]

Mate i hope you know that all your hard work is a appreciated!! and i will be purchasing some fabric once you iron out the supply issues.

[dch1950 37 1 Cars]

Hi Robert,

your thanks are much appreciated. I should say that I've been working on this aspect of my covers for over 2 years now, and for the most part it's been a very fruitless exercise. I'm not just doing it for altruistic reasons though, I've got a business to keep going. My attention has switched to India for the B09 fabric, and to China for "Quartet", but inevitably the sending and receiving of samples etc. is more time consuming. I could do with an assistant as the 1.6 bolster covers are keeping me occupied at the moment.

thanks for your kind observations.

regards

Dave

[2052NV 24]

yea im gutted i didnt buy any of the fabric you had recently sold out of as that looked really good!