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arwel

As some of you may know I have a 1.9 GTi rally car, engine is standard apart from filter and exhaust really. At the moment I am in the process of finding another car to start stripping for parts for the current car then eventually reshell mine.

 

Im thinking of having a tasty little motor to make me a bit more competitive on the stages. Im torn between doing a Gti6 conversion and running or carbs or stick with the 8v lump and rebuild it with carbs and few more toys.

 

Pros and cons of both? Im all new to the engine side of things really you see :lol:

 

Arwel

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welshpug

IMO I would save a few more pennies and do it properly with bodies regardless of the engine they'll be bolted to.

 

a standard rebuilt gti6 on bodies would be much quicker than most 8 valvers.

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Miles

Depends on Reg's more than anything,

But a Bodied GTi6 engine in std form will be around 175bhp

A 8v with mild head work, Exhaust, 285 ish cam will be about the same.

 

Cost, well depends on how far you want to go

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arwel

Cheers guys.

 

Regs wont be a problem as the new build would be an all out stage car and would slot into the relevent class. Cost would be the big one. Cheaper to source a good Gti6 lump or to carry out the work Miles states above on the 8v lump?

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matt.f

What about an MI16?

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arwel

The only thing that puts me off the MI lump is the oil starvation problem on the long fast corners. May just be me being over cautious about it all though. Are there any know cures for that problem?

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welshpug

only a dry sump, same as any other XU, just seems they tend to be more tired and more susceptible to death when that does occur

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arwel

So plenty of options available then. Basics are throttle boddies on a Gti6 lump would be the quickest with minimal modifications but a tickled 8v lump would give similar performance to a Gti6 lump. Im guessing the MI16 would be similar to the Gti6 lump?

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harryskid

There is also the S16 lump!

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Karl

yes beest options are s16 mi16 and gti6 gti6 is in my opinion the best because its more reliable and newer to an extent (people will argue about this on here tho lol) if you go standard you wont be dissapointed if your used to a 1.9 ;) but if ya gonna go modding it stick on some carbs upgrade ecu and get a lightened flywheel and you will be laughing also if you want better bottom end use a 1.6 gearbox :lol:

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arwel

I have been thinking about this more recently. If I was to continue with my plans of a 1.9 8v or a Gti6 lump etc.. it would put me in with some really powerful cars, Im talking proper power, Escorts with sorted Pinto's, XE's etc.. let alone everything else. I have bought another car that is a 1.6. What my latest though is if I stuck with a 1600 lump then that would put me in the 1401-1600cc class where I could be more competative than the 1601-2000cc class.

 

Would I be looking at same kind of mods to the 1600 lump as the 1900 lump in my current car and any idea if the 1600 reacts well to certain mods than others?

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brumster

Whatever class you go for, to be at the cutting end of it is going to be expensive. It's no different in the 1600 class to the 2000; in fact the big boys in the 1600 class are probably spending more as they strive for big power out of the smaller lumps.

 

Personally I would go 2-litre (S16/GTi6) as a starting point, which is a quick and relatively cheap route to 170-odd horses and some useful torque, but you have plenty of options in the future to upgrade bits and take it to wherever you want this side of 300bhp.

 

If you go 1900 8v and spend money tuning it to the same level, you've committed certain aspects of the engine to an expense that may be wasted if you want more and more later on... e.g. cam; if you then want to progress to a 200bhp 8v, it was money wasted. At least with the standard gti6/s16 setup you've not spent any money on expensive custom parts (bar maybe an exhaust and some throttle bodies - but they can last the duration of the car and future upgrades).

 

In up-to-2-litre you'll be up against Escorts pumping out 250-280 horses; in the 1600 class you'll have the likes of Kev Monaghan in his clicky-boxed 1600 Corsa with what must be at least 200 horses... so you can't win unless you spend the moooola (or you're naturally gifted, of course!) ;-)

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arwel

Whatever class you go for, to be at the cutting end of it is going to be expensive. It's no different in the 1600 class to the 2000; in fact the big boys in the 1600 class are probably spending more as they strive for big power out of the smaller lumps.

 

Personally I would go 2-litre (S16/GTi6) as a starting point, which is a quick and relatively cheap route to 170-odd horses and some useful torque, but you have plenty of options in the future to upgrade bits and take it to wherever you want this side of 300bhp.

 

If you go 1900 8v and spend money tuning it to the same level, you've committed certain aspects of the engine to an expense that may be wasted if you want more and more later on... e.g. cam; if you then want to progress to a 200bhp 8v, it was money wasted. At least with the standard gti6/s16 setup you've not spent any money on expensive custom parts (bar maybe an exhaust and some throttle bodies - but they can last the duration of the car and future upgrades).

 

In up-to-2-litre you'll be up against Escorts pumping out 250-280 horses; in the 1600 class you'll have the likes of Kev Monaghan in his clicky-boxed 1600 Corsa with what must be at least 200 horses... so you can't win unless you spend the moooola (or you're naturally gifted, of course!) ;-)

 

Thats very true indeed..I guess I shall keep all my options open for the time being.. Im not in any rush to do it as my current car is coping fine at the moment plus it ll give me time to build up some cash to crack on with it.. think I will need power as gifted I'm most certainly not, you cant have seen my onboards :lol:

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harryskid

Never mind about not being gifted, its about getting as much enjoyment as possible with out breaking the bank! ;)

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arwel

Never mind about not being gifted, its about getting as much enjoyment as possible with out breaking the bank! ;)

 

Thats also true and I have so much fun doing what I do now. I know I can improve as a driver but I also know I could go quicker if the car had the extra performance. Hopefully both will improve hand in hand and I can enjoy even more :D

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Miles

Can you stick a 16v head on? if so thats a route to use on the 1.6 bottom end

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welshpug

can do pretty much anything in stage rallying, so that'll be a hell yeah :)

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arwel

That is something that I hadnt thought of..I guess its an MI16 head that would be used? Anyone have any experience of how it would perform?

Edited by arwel

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Miles

You can use a Mi or GTi6/XSI/XU7 head no problems at all, Will be a real screamer as the 8v is anyway.

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arwel

Nice one Miles, that's another option to add to the engine choice.

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matt.f

8v ftw :D

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arwel

One other thing. If I was to use a 16v head and keep the standard injection system to begin with, would it still run on standard managment even though it would have an extra 8v etc..?

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unariciflocos

I imagine fueling would be way off given that the new head flows more air. Best go with a standalone ECU or carbs.

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harryskid

Surely there must be quite a bit more to this than just sticking an 8v head on?

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harryskid

Surely there must be quite a bit more to this than just sticking an 8v head on?

 

Opps i meant a 16v head!

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