Bad Brakes

[Rob Turbo 3]

On my 306 I've got GTI-6 brakes front and rear, GTI-6 master cylinder, mintex extreme pads up front, fresh fluid, no air in the system, all moving parts are free, no excess pedal travel, but they don't stop the car all that well, been like this ever since I fitted them but they do stop the car so I just put up with them. But my dad has a 306 diesel estate, with 266mm brakes and they're sh*t hot! If I press the brake pedal half as hard as I do mine I'd go through the windscreen, the thing is, how do I make mine that good? Really they should be better!

 

Could it be that the pads are too hard or something?

 

Thanks,

Rob

[Rob Thomson 6]

Sounds like the estate has typical modern over-servo'd brakes, whereas you have to give yours a bit of a shove. Nothing wrong with that, I bet the 205 stops just as fast as the 306.

 

You could try running OE-spec front pads, but it sounds like you want a smaller master-cylinder to reduce the pedal force required.

[Rob Turbo 3]

Smaller master cylinder? When I first put the front calipers on I had I think a 19mm master cylinder (and drums at the back) and the brakes were terrible, then when I put the turbo lump in I swapped to rear disks and a GTI-6 master cylinder and they got better but still nowhere near as good as the estate, and both cars are 306's, just one's an estate, and both servo's look the same, although maybe a fresh lenght of vaccumn pipe to the servo would be a good plan, the bit that's on looks a bit scabby so could possibly be past it's best!

 

And it doesn't stop just as quick, it can be scary at times!!

[sonofsam 5]

Silly question> Pads bedded in Ok and not glazed?!

 

Sure your not letting boost into the servo, although I dont know what exact effect that would have,

just an idea...

[welshpug 1,626]

make sure the load compensator if fitted isn't seized shut, if the rears aren't working at all it will have quite an effect however low their effort is on a healthy system.

 

one thing worth checking is the M/C to servo rod clearance. pretty sure there's a specified clearance for them just like the 205, which if set incorrectly can either cause binding or lack of pressure.

 

esit, and what Sonofsam said, there should be a valve in the vacuum line, check that it works.

Edited August 29, 2008 by welshpug

[boldy205 74]

Do these Mintex pads take a while to warm up maybe??

[Rob Thomson 6]

Sorry, didn't read the first post properly - thought they were GTi-6 brakes on a 205.

 

Anyway, you can check the servo easily enough by pumping the pedal with the engine on and then off. There should be a very significant difference in how the pedal feels.

[Rob Turbo 3]

There's a one way valve in the pipe, I've just been out and tried to tighten the clips on the pipe, one of them tightened by about half a turn, the other started to tighten then clicked loose so I replaced it with a new one which tightened up nicely, I haven't taken it out yet so don't know if there's a difference.

 

I don't know if the pads take a while to warm up, but with heavy use they get really bad, they're not binding, could be glazed I'll have to check.

 

Thanks for the replies, I'll get to work!!

[Rob Turbo 3]

The servo is all good, I put my foot on the pedal then started the engine and the pedal dropped a bit so it must be working. The brakes are still crap though, no change at all. I'll go and buy some new pads tomorrow, front and rear, the front's are still mint but the rears are low so I might as well do it now, I'll also check the compensator to make sure it's not stuck, it was free when I put the beam on but was stiff when it went in for a test a couple of months ago so the tester freed it off so it might need a good dose of oil/grease.

[Rob Turbo 3]

Got new pads all round today, bit of a nightmare at the motorfactors, they seem to think there's 3 types of pad for a gti6 front and 2 for the rear and told me to take one of each in to match up with, so I go home, take a couple of pads out and go back down in my parents' car, then they tell me it's not a gti6 front pad because it doesn't match any that they have in their book, funny that, the gti6 pads I bought off Miles fit perfectly! Anyhoo, they matched the pad up and I went and fitted them.

 

Back on topic! They are ever so slightly better, but the main thing, they don't squeak anymore

 

I had a look on service box and found that my dad's 306 estate has the same size master cylinder as mine but has a 25mm bigger servo, would 25mm make that much difference?

 

I'm not changing the servo even if it will make them better, I've got a pair of braided hoses for the front somewhere, I bought them ages ago and couldn't undo the union on the car so gave up, I'll dig them out and have another crack at them!

 

Thanks,

Rob

[mrswampy 0]

Got new pads all round today, bit of a nightmare at the motorfactors, they seem to think there's 3 types of pad for a gti6 front and 2 for the rear and told me to take one of each in to match up with, so I go home, take a couple of pads out and go back down in my parents' car, then they tell me it's not a gti6 front pad because it doesn't match any that they have in their book, funny that, the gti6 pads I bought off Miles fit perfectly! Anyhoo, they matched the pad up and I went and fitted them.

 

Back on topic! They are ever so slightly better, but the main thing, they don't squeak anymore

 

I had a look on service box and found that my dad's 306 estate has the same size master cylinder as mine but has a 25mm bigger servo, would 25mm make that much difference?

 

I'm not changing the servo even if it will make them better, I've got a pair of braided hoses for the front somewhere, I bought them ages ago and couldn't undo the union on the car so gave up, I'll dig them out and have another crack at them!

 

Thanks,

Rob

if you want a pair of rears to match i can supply them

[Rob Turbo 3]

Rear braided hoses? there's 4 isn't there?

 

Are you on the 306 forum, pug306.net or something? If so it might have been you that I got the fronts off! How much might they set me back? (they are for a 306 aren't they?)

 

Thanks,

Rob

[Phil H 16]

Rob,

Did you ever get to the bottom of this issue, as I have the same. New discs, new pads (just Lucas standard), 23mm master cylinder, new fluid, new copper pipes, new braided hoses. I do recall the last pads I had on crap discs stopped the car on a sixpence, but not now. nI even changed the servo, which was the GTI6 item and it was a right pig as I had to unbolt two engine mounts to get enough clearence to get it out, as fitted whilst I had the engine out.

 

Do I take it that the pads are just crap?