Wiring For Starter (hot Start Issue)

[kyepan 291]

Hi hi,

 

written this post about face.. so here is the short version for those that don't have time.

 

a) Does the thing guage white wire from the negative terminal on the starter run uninterrupted all the way to the connector block on the fuse/relay board in the glove box on an MI conversion with Motronic? (no brown connector block)

 

if there are other components in line what are they?

 

c) i seem to have some alarm/imobiliser related fuel pump wiring from changing the tank last week, but have had the alarm replaced, it almost acts as if the imobiliser is armed... has anyone got any advice on where i might find alarm wiring spliced into any igniton related wiring.

 

d) does anyone have the xu9j4 wiring diagram or can i find it in my 405 haynes.

 

long version

Regarding the wiring for my MI, I've been having hot start issues, as in it won't when it is. What happens is when i turn the key to position 3 (fire starter) the relay in the glove box clicks, the dials go dead but otherwise there is an eerie silence, no starter turning, no starter solonoide clicking, nothing, nada zip.

 

My usual wiggle of the relays didn't seem to cure it, and now it won't start till fairly cold.

 

soooo.. to get to the point.

the relays are warm to touch when it is in the not starting state, i've got several spares from batfink(who is a legend and helped greatly changing my fuel tank last weekend, kev you rock!) so its not the relay..

 

Anthony suggested next time it did it to take a wire from the positive battery terminal and touch it to the starter, did this and hey presto the starter fired, engine started (saved my bacon there anthony as i was stuck in sanisburys car park with a fuming girfriend and melting chocolate in the boot, owe you a beer)

 

so its the wire, or something between the key in the ignition and the starter negative... process of asumption begins. when the key is turned the solonoid clicks, so the ignition barrel is working, the relay is clicking, so it is working (have spares to test with) so its something after the relay, either the fuse board, the connectors on the board, the wire, or the starter connection, or the starter itself.

 

dad thinks it's either

a relay further down from the fuse board relay in glove box which i'm not aware of, or the fuseboard is corroded, or the spade connector on the starter is corroded.

but doesn't think its the wire.. as copper doesn't do odd things electrically when its hot says he.

anyhow he is going to help test some components tomorrow.

 

also tomorrow, i'm going to investigate further , and possibly run a bypass wire from the fuse board / connector on the fuse board to the starter negative terminal (white wire) and or clean all connections etc etc on the way. whilst changing the starter and radiator for ease of access.

 

... question at the top.

 

as usual guys, your help is most definitly appreciated, and also appreciate that the search engine is down so i can't just do a search

Edited October 19, 2007 by kyepan

[pug_ham 242 3 Cars]

Depending on how the wiring has been done on your Mi will determine if the wire is one almost complete run to the fuse board,

 

Basically though, with or without the brown multiplug it runs effectively one length of wire right to the fuseboard afaik.

 

Its not an earth wire though, its the solenoid feed wire, the starter earths through the block & gearbox earth lead directly back to the battery negative terminal.

 

I think this could be simlar to a fault which stumped me for a week on a friends car. The starter would click but not turn & relays in the fusebox were clicking away & eventually the earth wire to the passenger strut top started smoking & the rev counter was jumping around.

 

Finally noticed that the gearbox earth stud was loose, tightened that back up & its been fine ever since.

 

Graham.

[kyepan 291]

thanks for the reply graham,

 

Been looking at the wiring diagrams for the xu5ja and the xu9j4, think i have the measure of it and agree. In both diagrams the wire from the fuse board goes directly to the solonoid terminal, (with the exception of when its an auto)..

 

the wire in question 8v loom wire No#46 (white in my case ) goes from the fuse board out through the right hand gromit (drivers pov) and should go straight to the solonoid connection on the starter, this should have had a wire spliced into it for the 8v loom going to the injection ecu, whether this is still present i'm not sure. but by the looks of it, i should be able to run a bypass straight from the connector on the fuse board, through the bulk head following the loom and out at the starter.

 

My worrys about the alarm wiring are now non existent, as the alarm is spliced into the positive wire #1 from the battery to the fuse board and they do not interrupt wire 46.

 

the wire 46 coming out of the fuse board is definitly larger gauge than the one connected to the solonoid on the starter, so i think that it's spliced somewhere.

 

and isn't it ironic that now i'm sure what is causing it, poking around (moved a bit of loom very slightly) to get a crocodile clip for the multimeter on the starter solonoid terminal has caused it to start first time every time hot or cold.

 

so.. I'll do the starter and radiator, unsplice the loom whils't i'm there and run a bypass anyway, because chances are it will decide to revert to not starting at the worst possible time.

 

Will feed back later .

 

J

[kyepan 291]

just so this is now cleared up, i'm fairly sure its solved, when i had the radiator out and starter motor off i noticed the little wire was split, rusted and had oil / dirt on it, I snipped it off and extended from the good wire, touch wood no more hot start issues.