Xu10 Sump On Mi16

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

Just managed to find a baffled xu10 sump in my local scrapyard, obviousley this is deeper than the standard alloy sump on the mi16 so will i need to remove the spacer plate to allow the oil pump to sit at the same depth ??

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

[brianthemagical 1]

yes remove the spacer, did you get the shorter bolts? how much was the sump?

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

i got all the bolts that came with it, got it for £20

[brianthemagical 1]

mine was 45 posted with no bolts, but the bolts were free.

Edited August 3, 2007 by brianthemagical

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

Where from ? Has this made a decent noticeable difference then to the dreaded surge ???

[petert 554]

The primary function of the spacer is to stiffen the bottom of the alloy block. The ideal thing to do is fit the Mi16 spacer, 2L sump and extend the pickup, with something like my pickup extension - http://www.taylor-eng.com/sump/wetsump.htm

Edited August 3, 2007 by petert

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

Will the xu10 sump be suitable for now though?? its really only a road car with the very occasional trackday ive also fitted the uprated xu10 oil pump spring too.

Edited August 4, 2007 by chris 417 mi

[petert 554]

Will the xu10 sump be suitable for now though?? its really only a road car with the very occasional trackday ive also fitted the uprated xu10 oil pump spring too.

 

That's up to you, but I wouldn't fit it without the spacer plate.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

As Peter said, it is not a spacer, it is a block stiffener, though i have not heard of any cracked blocks from those that have run without (sure Miles will chip in here!!). When turboing my 1900 CTI (that has a 1.6 style sump as standard), one of the reasons I swapped to an alloy sump was to get extra strengthening as well as the better oil cooling properties. XU10 would have lowered my sump more and i have already split a sump open in speedbump Sheffield before

[petert 554]

Using the spacer + 2L sump won't make the sump hang 15mm deeper. As the engine is tilted at 30 degrees the extra theoretical depth is 13mm, but you also gain 5mm or so as there are no fins on the 2L sump. So nett extra depth is only approx.8mm.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

So with no fins, does it mean it cools the oil as well as an ally 1905 sump? Only reason I ask is that my low pressure turbo never has any oil temp problems and it doesn't run an oil cooler

[Henry 1.9GTi 36]

check radiator and lowrstrut brace clearance with that sump, those wings get in the way of everything, had to hacksaw mine off to clear everything. and it does seem very low although no issues yet as I havn't driven it

[chris 417 mi 28 2 Cars]

Well other than the dowel on the block being too large for the sump hole (sorted with an 8mm drill bit) it fits fine! goes over speed bumps ok and i have 4-6 bar pressure whilst driving now which is a bonus

[philfingers 5]

Anyone any ideas if this will fit with a proper PTS forest guard?

Thanks,

Phil

[Bonzai 2]

the xu10 sump i have doesnt have a hole for an oil temp sender, only the sump plug, i was wondering if i could buy a temp sender and use it as a sump plug?!?!

 

if i were to do this which sender should i get as i can see 2 available that will fit, one is 155degrees, the other is 165degrees. what was the standard sender with the 8v or Mi's?

 

[James_m 0]

Funny this topic should come back up, i funnily got on track yesterday with this setup....

 

To clarify, extended oil pump pick up, XU10 trap door sump, and 6.5 litres of oil running an 8v oil cooler.

 

My thoughts are as follows:

 

Running bad ass pirelli P700 195's on the front, and 185 michelin excalto 2's on the back, on a stock ish suspended 205 my grip levels were not massivly high, never the less left handers had the pressure dropping off to varying degree's with one especially long left hander forcing me to back right off(this was bedford autodrome btw)

 

Which kind of killed my fun a little, being handicapped by this rubbish engine

Left handers that came and went quicker were less of a problem, with the corner ending before the pressure had much of a chance to drop.

 

At no point did i get the stop light on, not sure surge is bad enough to acheive that, though i wasnt really about to try.

 

Right handers only suffered minor surge, and were not really a problem.

 

So, in summary the Mi16 is a liability of an engine for track work, of which im not quite sure how CW, and the other track regulars get by having to put up with it.

 

Id have had more fun in an 8v 100%

 

Bonzai, that would work with the XU10 sender, but ive read the 8v senders are a different sized thread, but having only read it, i cant be sure.

[24seven 104]

thinking about it, if an Mi16 suffers oil surge issues, wouldn't an uprated pump spring cause it to pump oil through faster, and make the problem seem worse?

[Bonzai 2]

Bonzai, that would work with the XU10 sender, but ive read the 8v senders are a different sized thread, but having only read it, i cant be sure.

 

yeah the xu9 sender is a bigger thread (16 x 1.50), the xu10 ones appear to be 14 x 1.25 but come in atleast 2 temperatures, so i want to know what the standard xu9 temperature sender is so i can keep a relatively accurate guage

[Bonzai 2]

oh another thing James,

 

the last couple of weeks ive been watching my oil Px guage like a hawk and ive noticed that even on very tight corners where pressure drops to (what the guage suggests is) <1 Bar, by accelerating even slightly the pressure will rise again.

 

So perhaps by changing your driving style you could keep the pressure up?

 

 

(awaits to be told im wrong and killing my engine)

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

My brother was chucking his Mi (1.9) around Curborough and kept getting surging and Stop light, despite full oil. So he tried the course the other way round (clockwise) and got the same!! Basically an Mi engine does not like G force. He also said he would have had more fun in his 8v!

[VisaGTi16v 1]

Only have the standard gauge in my Visa but ive only seen that drop a little bit on some hard left handers. Thats with a 90k+ old Mi16, PTS baffle plate and about 30 sprints, 2 track days and 10k on the road and I compete on slicks so cornering loads are high. Bound to go bang now ive said that but ive had my monies worth. I know its their weakness but not sure why they are fine for some people and not others.

 

Dont see the point of an uprated oil pump spring. The pump works fine when not cornering, if you have surge and no oil to pick up its irrelevant how strong the pump spring is as its just sucking air

[taylorspug 7]

Im not going anywhere near a track with my MI in its current (standard) setup, i can get the bloody stop light on round roundabouts with cheap ass Marangonis!

 

Im intruiged by your setup though Visa, sounds like it is actually working well, and must be really as its stood the test of time. The most tyre-wise my car would get if i was to take it on track would be a set of Paradas (and only then if i had my serious hat on!), so if you are having reasonable results running slicks thats a bit encouraging...

 

And no, the pump spring wont make a blind bit of difference, ive got one in mine and there is no real change in the oil pressure at any point over the standard item!

[petert 554]

At no point did i get the stop light on, not sure surge is bad enough to acheive that, though i wasnt really about to try.

 

I've got my adj. pressure switch set to 25psi. It only comes on at idle (hot). Sure, the needle moves about a bit, but there's plenty of oil pressure to do the job.

[RonnieG 0]

Interesting item this & how it seems so variable from car to car.......Must be more to it ???

 

I currently have a trackday only now Mi16'd 205. Apart from a Catcam & twin radiator fans the engine is totally standard, no sump baffle & running Toyo Proxes to their limit (Gonna get some slicks over the winter though & keep the Proxes for wet outings!)

 

I've done 5 or 6 trackdays in it now at Knockhill in Scotland with no oil pressure issues at all. I watched the guage & light like a hawk first couple of outings but don't really bother now.......

 

I just run with the oil level about 5-6mm above max (Not ideal but lesser of any evils I've thought) & the twin fans on permanently while I'm on track to keep the temp bang on or very slightly under normal on the guage.

 

Was watching a couple of decent baffles on fleabay for a while but at £100+ I haven't done any more about it as everything's been ok.

 

Like above hope this isn't famous last words but no probs so far......