Help With Brakes Please

[TVR Gary 0]

Been using my old girl for the last couple of years purely as a track car. The track in question is the Nurburgring with the car living there.

 

I have until recently run with standard disks front and back and DS2000 pads. After a £5 ebay bargain I have been giving DS3000's a try. The pads were used with new disks bought from french / german / swedish.

 

When running the DS2000's I NEVER had a problem with brake fade, or any other adverse effects. The front pads probably lasting 70 laps and the rears 100 or more.

 

With the DS3000's I suffered after around 20 laps from the judder feeling. I have had in previously on the scoob, it being either warped disks or pad transfer. The judder got steadily worse until the car was pretty undriveable. I was hoping it was simply pad transfer and tried cleaning them off by riding the brakes a bit on normal driving and that didn't work.

 

I am now in a quandry.....Do I stick with the 3000's, them giving excellent braking performance and uprate the disks or do I go back to what worked in the past?

 

Any advice would be appreciated, especially around disks you would recommend.

 

I wont be going for a big brake conversion, I dont think I need it and dont like the idea of it.

 

Cheers

Gary

[RobMGti 0]

I know you do alot at the ring mate so i would assume getting uprated disks to match the uprated pads would be bennificial in the long run as it would allow later breaking and your lap times may come down abit.

 

Going back to the previous setup - yes it works but if you were getting towards the limit of what the brakes were capable of in terms of lap times i would recommend new disks.

 

If it helps i had some Brembo ones on my track car which seemed up to the challenge with some Mintex pads, think they were the ones up from 114's :s cant remember now

 

Rob

Edited May 2, 2006 by RobMGti

[TVR Gary 0]

Lap times aren't everything to me. Its more important that the car runs well for 30 - 40 laps over the course of a weekend.

 

Any help on where I can get a good price on uprated disks would be appreciated.

 

Cheers

Gary

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

Gary, I had the exact same problem with DS3000s recently too. It juddered violently, had the discs skimmed, next track it juddred even worse after the first session. On the inside of the disc a piece of the pad had bonded to the disc, when I chipped it off and sanded it clean the brakes are now smooth again.

 

However I don't know why this has happened as previously I had no problems with these pads. I had a different set on when I went back in August (still DS3000s tho) and these were brilliant no judder at all round the ring.

 

Had similar problems with my M Coupe with DS2500 pads at the ring though I think this could be genuine disc warpage as the discs look quite "clean".

[TVR Gary 0]

The weight of the M coupe probably led to warped discs . Too much heat in big one piece discs, much the same as with my old scoob.

 

I think it is pad transfer and will try to resolve it by sending new discs out and changing to a set of Mintex pads I have lying around.

 

What discs would you buy on a small repeatable budget and where from?

 

Gary

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

Well the discs I bought for the M Coupe were the same make as have been on the 205 for 3 years and plenty of trackdays with no sign of problems (until recently). They are BREMTECH from www.brakeparts.co.uk. I bet standard discs are really cheap from there. Delivery isn't too steep either.

 

I've had the original floating 2-piece M3 discs skimmed and put back on the BMW now.

[TVR Gary 0]

I will give them a go C_W cheers for that.

 

I couldnt stop the issues with brake judder no matter what I did. Even the guys with AP upgrades suffer the same.........Heavy cars and brakes just dont go together.

 

I have a friend who drives a white CSL. He is probably the most agressive CSL driver on the ring. He bought the biggest porsche brakes he could and used pure race pads. This weekend he killed the pads with chunks the size of 20p's falling off. Its funny listening to a broad Finnish accent calling Porsche brakes f'ing s*ite...........

 

Cheers for the help.

 

Gary

[smckeown 1]

ATE power discs from GSF served jonmurghie well. I don't use anything other than mintex on my track cars. 1155s or 1166s would do you

[C_W 3 1 Cars]

Yea the ATE powerdiscs might be worth a go as the groove may reduce or eliminate the disc deposit thing.

 

Maybe the BMW issue is cooling the brakes as the 911 (ie Turbo) is heavier than an M3 CSL and my M Coupe (both around 1450kg) AFAIK. I was just surprised at how quickly they went off TBH, not sure if it was becuase at the Ring you can't warm the brakes up slowly properly so you go out flat out and the first set of brake points are at 120mph+ on potnetially cold discs.

[Phil 0]

I run DS3000s and rate them very very highly!