Another Ignition Q

[soundguy 13]

I was advised by an auto electrician that my ignition barrel is duff and that's why there was an extra solenoid in the ignition circuit. He couldn't do anything about getting it bypassed or fixed but suggested a starter button.

 

How do I keep the ignition barrel in place and integrate something like that? What wires would be connected to it?

Edited April 6, 2017 by soundguy

[toolie72 67 1 Cars]

Three wires to ignition

That's all I'm saying-you're basically hot wiring it-so not posting instructions on here-you'll need to work it out

[soundguy 13]

Work it out? - as in, set fire to it while getting electrocuted. Great, sounds fun. Thanks for your 'help'!

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Not a very good auto Elec by the sounds of it, A 205 ign is dead simple to work out and fix, General points as always, Starter motor (Big body type?) Alarm, Brown multi plug condition and the starter connection, Ignition switch again is easy to buy new and fit.

[Ozymandis 96]

Work it out? - as in, set fire to it while getting electrocuted. Great, sounds fun. Thanks for your 'help'!

Dont be "sarky" he isn`t going to publish instructions on how to steal a 205 on the open forum.

 

Sack your auto electrician.

 

If you cant sort out three wires, then you shouldnt be out in a car by youself its a VERY complicated process driving it.

[soundguy 13]

Well if we're not giving advice on 'how to steal' our own 205s I'd better not ask you about taking the Laserline immob out of the circuit.

 

It's more than just 'three wires' when there's an extra component, alarm, immobiliser needs to be taken into account by a non electrician.

 

Feel free to wind your neck in

[steve@cornwall 100]

If i have this right you want to retain the key switch for ignition on and then push a button for starter only? It's a case of supplying the starter button from the positive out from the switch so that pushing the button energises the starter motor solenoid whose wife gets connected to the out of the starter button. However.......For the cost of a replacement barrel why risk possible insurance difficulties? Say the car gets stolen and recovered half stripped after you have compromised the factory fitted security ( such as it is).

 

And it would be really irresponsible to publish a full guide to direct wiring on a forum open to the public.

 

I would also hazard a strong guess that the switch is fine if it turns as it should, but the problem lies with the ageing wiring from the starter solenoid to inside the cabin. A very very common problem with 205s. The extra relay is a common work around for this ( read bodge)

You can check this by running a replacement wire, idcuse a larger that's wire) from the solenoid on the starter ( temporarily replacing the small blue wire) and with the car in neutral and ignition off, touch the other end to the battery positive and see if starter spins. If it does, then take the open end of the new wire inside the car, and touch it to the starter wire from the ignition switch while turning the key normally

If this works, best bet is to intigrate this new wire into your engine loom to the brown multiplug under the dash..My bodged one has this wire merely taped to the loom in the engine bay and then soldered at the ignition switch and has worked fine for many years

 

 

Edit. If I'd have read your last post before typing, i wouldn't have bothered.

Edited April 7, 2017 by steve@cornwall

[welshpug 1,626]

rtfm.

 

its all in the haynes workshop manual.

[steve@cornwall 100]

How unhelpful, Mei (wink)

[soundguy 13]

Edit. If I'd have read your last post before typing, i wouldn't have bothered.

In that case I'd better (not?) thank you for your very helpful post.

 

Thanks anyway.

[steve@cornwall 100]

No probs. Once you have chance to think laterally about it, you'll see Paul's original post was actually very helpful. ( Hint...How many key positions? How many aren't working? What's left?)

[toolie72 67 1 Cars]

Be doing well to get a shock from 12volt DC

Ever tested a pp9 with your tongue (that's a whole 9volts DC ouch I'm on fire whaaaaaaay)

Stairlifts run on 24 volts DC and old wifies don't fry on the f***ing things

[soundguy 13]

http://www.darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin1999-50.html

 

If you're stupid enough you can kill yourself with a 9v battery actually. I'm pretty keen to not short something out and end up melting my new looms/getting an engine bay fire.

 

Obviously insulated stairlifts have got nothing at all to do with 205 ignition barrels so really not sure what point your trying to make there.

[toolie72 67 1 Cars]

Insulated-shows how much you know about dc

Perhaps just getting a different auto electrician to look at it would be a better idea than you blindly battering in

A CIRCUIT IS A CIRCUIT

GOODBYE

[soundguy 13]

You can check this by running a replacement wirefrom the solenoid on the starter ( temporarily replacing the small blue wire) and with the car in neutral and ignition off, touch the other end to the battery positive and see if starter spins. If it does, then take the open end of the new wire inside the car, and touch it to the starter wire from the ignition switch while turning the key normally

 

Steve, this worked perfectly - thanks very much for your clear instruction. I haven't permanently integrated a new wire yet because I've still got a couple of questions - if you can help out again I'd really appreciate it.

I've got four wires coming out of the back of the barrel and they're all pretty thick - do you know what gauge I should be using? That is, if the new wire is going direct to the starter solenoid spade, should it be the same gauge from barrel to spade?

Is it normal for the four barrel wires to be shrouded in a sleeve, and to end up being something like six wires or more, within 30cm of the barrel?

The barrel wires are x2 yellow, x1 red, x1 orange - then convert/incorporate multiple thick white wires at some point under the shroud and split off into two connectors, one white, one brown and I think some wires pass straight on into a loom section. Is this usual?

There will definitely be a third party alarm/immobiliser integrated so the Laserline is out - heard it was very easy to get around these so that's why I've removed it for replacement.

I'm presuming the ECU reads from the output of the immob and will never let the car start if it's out of the equation?

Aftermarket central locking has been installed and the alarm/immob will be the same brand so it can integrate.

I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts.

Edited April 18, 2017 by soundguy

[welshpug 1,626]

engine ecu doesn't read anything, they are pretty primitive things, all the immobiliser will do is cut a live ignition feed or fuel pump feed.

 

standard ignition barrel wiring is shrouded yes, there will be a pair of plugs clipped to the top of the kick panel then another section of loom going over to the fuseboard.

 

the solenoid wire doesn't need to be as thick as the main ignition barrel wiring, only the same as what exists in the engine loom, this will usually join the dashboard loom in a pair of brown plugs between the steering column and the heater box, age dependent.

 

[soundguy 13]

Thanks for your responses Mei, helpful and informative as usual. Can crack on with getting these changes in place now. One other question, you ever come across a large red multiplug under the dash/part of the loom which doesn't connect to anything?

Maybe I haven't found a home for it when I've had the looms out but can't see what it's supposed to connect back together with.

Edited April 18, 2017 by soundguy

[pug_ham 241 3 Cars]

One other question, you ever come across a large red multiplug under the dash/part of the loom which doesn't connect to anything?

 

Stereo loom?

 

g

[soundguy 13]

Sounds like a likely candidate, ta.

[jackherer 543]

 

The barrel wires are x2 yellow, x1 red, x1 orange - then convert/incorporate multiple thick white wires at some point under the shroud and split off into two connectors, one white, one brown and I think some wires pass straight on into a loom section. Is this usual?

 

 

That sounds standard to me, often the immobiliser will be lazily spliced in at this point which is insecure but does make it easy to remove, however it sounds like yours is spliced in further along somewhere unless the wires you say "pass straight on into a loom section" are actually the immobiliser, what colour are these wires?

[soundguy 13]

I'll have to take a pic and get it uploaded JH, can't remember accurately enough to describe (although given the amount of times I've sat there shaking my head at it, should be burned into my mind).

[steve@cornwall 100]

As said i would imagine the wiring going to "it's own loom" will be the immobilizer, just an interuption in the ignition live.If you can get hold of an original loom from the ignition switch to main loom it would be useful to plug that in and see how it works. Likely that will isolate the immobiliser