Paddle Clutch Options

[rallyeash 155]

Hi all,

 

I'm looking at replacement clutch plate for my 205 after my current paddle clutch has broken up.

 

My current one is a Luk 4 paddle clutch and only covered a few thousand miles, ok all of those are bloody hard miles but I don't believe it's upto the job.

 

So browsing spooks website this eve and looking at my options I think I'm either going to purchase it with an AP or helix clutch plate.

I've narrowed down to either

 

4 plate AP

http://www.spoox.co.uk/en/405/566-ap-racing-peugeot-405-19-mi16-paddle-clutch-friction-plate.html

 

Helix 4 plate

http://www.spoox.co.uk/en/405/3554-helix-peugeot-405-19-mi16-4-paddle-friction-plate-215mm.html

 

Looking at the pictures of each the AP looks better built and made

 

Or a 6 plate helix

http://www.spoox.co.uk/en/clutch-plates/5642-peugeot-106-gti-citroen-saxo-vts-helix-clutch-cover-1999-on.html

 

 

Or..... A solid centre Helix on 6 paddle.

http://www.spoox.co.uk/en/clutch-plates/5642-peugeot-106-gti-citroen-saxo-vts-helix-clutch-cover-1999-on.html

 

The solid centre style interests me, however if something went wrong down the line would the damage be more without your conventional spring setup offering some protection to the gearbox/flywheel.

 

Cheers all

Edited November 23, 2014 by rallyeash

[rallyeash 155]

My current clutch, please don't say 'a good quality standard one will be fine' because it simply won't!

 

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

I ran an AP 4 paddle sprung clutch on my 1900 road rally car, was fantastic and did nothing but launches it's entire life, It saw no mercy whatsoever. It wore out eventually but didn't break, mega clutch IMO.

 

I think the problem with yours ash is the revs, don't a lot of the charged 6 lot have clutch issues like you have? I think they all go for helix.

[rallyeash 155]

Good to hear, I think your right and some charged 6's run Helix. Any idea on the one with no conventional springs?

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

I've never used an unsprung clutch so can't comment really. I imagine they're harsher on everything, could be what you need though if it's the springs breaking that cause the plate to split or rivets to let go?!

[GilesW 41]

The springs give a little forgiveness to the drive train, and when your pulling away.

I always go for a sprung one.

 

My 4 paddle helix handled my last car fine. But as its all mtorsport stuf, like everything it doesn't last forever.

However should wear out rather than fail like yours.

[pip470 61]

Just wanted to give my experiences. Had a nightmare with clutches and heres what i ended up with.

tilton twin plate with no springs and 4 paddles per plate. It is awful to drive around town. It has held everything ive thrown at it though and launches, gear changes are great. There really is no forgiveness on drivetrain parts though and how long they last is anyone's guess. Just for info this setup is apparently ok for 800ft lbs of torque which it will never see.

 

 

Ive also tried the helix 4 paddle again with no springs out of desperation as i ran out of options knowing that i was sold it for n/a only as it doesn't really have a high torque rating and it did slip when on the gas but not on turbo only. A little bit more controllable but not much.

 

The last problem i had was the clutch pedal, I would start the drive fine but as it progressed it got harder and harder to get it into gear. Eventually traced this back to the rubber on the clutch cable near the turbo changing how squishy it was with the heat. Also the plastic parts on the cable were not up to the increased force needed to push the pedal. So made some alloy ones up and now all is well. Hydraulic clutch would be the way to go though.

Edited November 23, 2014 by pip470

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

My Helix has done 4 years now and 1400 miles in total without any issues, that's the normal spring type

The old 7 1/4's are spot on as well, The only issue you get with these sometimes is the bell housing cracking around the clutch arm due to the increased loading on it, Phill's clutch cable mods is another worth while mod

[rallyeash 155]

I was growing the net last night and the common problem seems to be clutch cable failure and several people have made up alloy replacements.

 

Think I'm going to go with a helix 4 paddle and re use my cover plate

 

I'd like a setup like yours pip. How much was it though?

[pip470 61]

£800. For the twin plate Tilton.

[rallyeash 155]

Hmm yeah that's my problem. 6 months ago I wouldn't of been worried about that but right now I'm 30k deep in setting up my business!

[rallyeash 155]

Gone for a Helix 4 paddle. I can't justify spending that much on the above then have clutch cable problems. My Luk clutch lasted 4 years and i think a Helix should be made for it

[dcc 855]

why not go hydraulic clutch ash?

[rallyeash 155]

Cost and I don't really see a big issue with the cable setup.

[welshpug 1,626]

cost is not major.

[GilesW 41]

Do helix do an.updated pressure plate too?

[rallyeash 155]

No but i don't see the cable clutch a problem so it'll stay. Isn't going to make it a better track car.

[GilesW 41]

They do an updated plate for the vaux f20 which we always used as the increased clamping force was useful for track cars.

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

Cg motorsports friction plate

[Sandy 189]

Sprung centres don't really help in an application like this, they can dislodge and jam/drag the plate which causes selection problems and inevitably gearbox damage, which is often blamed on the box or gear linkage, when the clutch plate is in fact the problem. Solid centres are usually fine and not harsh to use if the cover is specced correctly, but covers are generally over-specced on atmo engines, which leads to pointless lever/cable problems. The standard OE covers have adequate clamping for for most NA engines and if it's a serious engine pulling 8KRPM on a regular basis, then you should be using a 7.25" race clutch; pressed steel covers fatigue and break up which sustained high RPM use. A race clutch will set you back near £1000 with the flywheel needed mind, so a big step up! Again the covers are usually over-specced, which drives me nuts, with suppliers being over-cautious or lazy; a clutch that's suited to the engine will be much nicer to use and more reliable.

 

The final note, is that on serious output engines, a spigot bearing on the input shaft is really needed to prevent the clutch wandering of centre, which causes numerous problems, again a bit of an expensive job!

Edited December 3, 2014 by Sandy