205 Rosejointed Wishbones / Max Neg Camber?

[Longfield 0]

Hi All,

 

I;ve done a search and can't find what i'm looking for so thought i'd ask...

 

1... what's the max neg camber you can get when using 205 rosejointed wishbones with ecentric topmounts?

2... does anyone know if anyone sells rosejointed 309 wishbones?

 

At the moment I'm running 309 wishbones and driveshafts with ecentric topmounts which gives me -1.5d camber. I need more. When racing my car is understeering like a pig and in the photos you can see that my rear wheels are running vertical around corners [they're set at -3d neg camber] whereas the front is in a positive camber situation when going around corners... so more neg camber on the front will help alot when racing.

 

Thanks all

Longfield

[James_R 3]

When I looked at mine it was in the 2.5deg region 309 wishbones and the ecc's set to max camber.

 

Past that comp brake will do "custom" wishbones at extra length for your requirements.

[welshpug 1,631]

sounds like its under sprung and leaning a lot?

[Craigb 2]

Are you running any additional castor ?

 

this would help

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

I'm looking at getting these made with options of cheap and good quality Rose joint's, Expected price is around £200.00 the pair but without bushes as you can fit what you need then,

[Cameron 16]

A million other things could be causing it to understeer, it isn't necessarily down to the camber! When I had mine on just 309 wishbones I didn't have any horrific understeer issues. You don't really want any more than 3 or 4 degrees, mine is 3 deg at the front and getting very even wear on track.

[Longfield 0]

My full set up is -1.5d camber, neutral castor and 2mm toe out... my springs are 350lb but my dampers aren't competition shocks... something I am going to change for the new season. For me I thought -3d neg camber plus better shocks would be a revalation. I'm using compbrake ecentric top mounts... do people think it should be possible to get -3d camber on the front somehow given that at the moment I only seem to be able to get half that? If others think I may be undersprung on the front... what lb'age would you recommend? I'm aware the Alfa 33's of similar weight are using 550lb front springs... but I thought stiffer springs would just exacerbate the problem.

[engine killer 5]

I'm looking at getting these made with options of cheap and good quality Rose joint's, Expected price is around £200.00 the pair but without bushes as you can fit what you need then,

 

Hi Miles, I have seen most of the custom modified wishbones have to disconnect the hub and arm which is not convenience at all. I have made one sometimes ago but failed completely due to wrongly choose of a thin two ends mail/female rod. do you think a much thicker two ends male/female rod will handle the weight?

[welshpug 1,631]

you haven't mentioned the rear spring rates or ARB at all?

 

may well be that the front dampers aren't up to 350lb springs, most can be adapted to suit though.

[Rippthrough 98]

I would be very dubious about running any form of wishbone like you've made at all - unless you make the thread larger than the section you've cut out you're going encounter massive amounts of concentrated stress at the thread roots, I'm not surprised they broke, I'd be afraid to put those on a pedal car!

Edited September 12, 2009 by Rippthrough

[pdd144c 0]

I'd be getting rid of the toe out to start...

[Longfield 0]

I'd be getting rid of the toe out to start...

 

why? It's actually helped turn in and reduce understeer... what issues would you normally expect toe-out to cause?

 

I might try uprating my shocks to see if, as someone has proposed they're not up to the job...

[welshpug 1,631]

toe out is common on gravel I've head, but certainly not on tarmac, parallel seems to be the trend.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Do what ever suit's you, Never follow any Trends etc, Much like the old 309 beam thing!!

[ravydavy 0]

i'd be ditching those wishbones dude. they are not safe. you need something tested by a proper company. you need a tyre pyrometer to check the tyre temp when you get off track. you may be running too much neg camber which would cause you understeer. if you test the tyre temp across the whole of the tyre you'll know what you need to run. are you getting uneven tyre wear??

[Longfield 0]

i'd be ditching those wishbones dude. they are not safe. you need something tested by a proper company. you need a tyre pyrometer to check the tyre temp when you get off track. you may be running too much neg camber which would cause you understeer. if you test the tyre temp across the whole of the tyre you'll know what you need to run. are you getting uneven tyre wear??

 

I certainly like my safety [an oxymoron I know when I enjoy racing] but this is the first I've heard or read of 309 wishbones being unsafe. Could you please elaborate for me?

 

On a tangent to this re: safety, I remember the chap from xport at Oulton Park advising on a seam welded subframe as he said the un-seamwelded ones for circuit racing wouldn't be strong enough. So I was glad I had one installed!

 

On a second slight tangent... in looking for competition dampers for the 205, I've come across a link from a Koni distributor to KW... does KW therefore use Koni dampers?

[EdCherry 34 1 Cars]

Longfield think he is on about the attempt of adjustable wishbones.

[Rippthrough 98]

does KW therefore use Koni dampers?

 

I've only took one set apart, but they did appear to be using Koni pistons/inserts, but they tend to be valved for a lot more rebound damping (probably because the continental roads are so much smoother), they're using a different oil to Koni too, seems slightly heavier weight, I'd guess it's one of the Silkolene Medium weight oils but not certain on that without asking them.

[ravydavy 0]

I certainly like my safety [an oxymoron I know when I enjoy racing] but this is the first I've heard or read of 309 wishbones being unsafe. Could you please elaborate for me?

 

On a tangent to this re: safety, I remember the chap from xport at Oulton Park advising on a seam welded subframe as he said the un-seamwelded ones for circuit racing wouldn't be strong enough. So I was glad I had one installed!

 

On a second slight tangent... in looking for competition dampers for the 205, I've come across a link from a Koni distributor to KW... does KW therefore use Koni dampers?

 

Sorry i was talking about the wishbones done by engine killer. I don't like the look of them. the 309 arms are cast aren't they? you would need a special type of welding rod or mig wire to weld them i would think.

[Cameron 16]

Nahh you don't need special rods for cast as far as I'm aware.

[ravydavy 0]

Nahh you don't need special rods for cast as far as I'm aware.

 

 

The basic problem with welding cast iron is that it is, as everyone knows, ... http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/cast-iron.htm

 

EDIT: Do not paste whole web pages in to your posts, put a link instead. Unless you wrote the page and therefore own the copyright.

Edited September 15, 2009 by jackherer
removed text in breach of copyright

[phatgti 0]

Take the toe out off a fwd car? are you crazy man?!

 

Alfa 33, 890kg without driver - 3mm toe out, 3° camber on all 4 corners, 2mm toe out on the rear - quite normal for a circuit race car (FWD), couldn't comment on rally cars.

 

Al, just talk to Brunswick about those wisebone pics i sent you - they'll make you a pair no problem.

 

Don't forget the rear affects the front just as much as anything else.

 

Testing, testing, testing

[Pt2051900tdic 0]

Hi

I bought a wishbones of compbrake but now I encountered a problem.

The wishbones hit the ARB, has anyone had this problem?

How resolving?

[boombang 2]

you haven't mentioned the rear spring rates or ARB at all?

As above

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Everyone has theat problem, They don;t fit with a ARB simple as I;m afraid, Return them for a refund.

I think there was a group buy on hear a while back and everyone found this out

 

On another note I know of some which should be ready early next year, Both type of modded standard wishbone and a custom made wishbone that does clear the ARB so details will be available when I know