Jump to content

205GTIDrivers.com has just received a major redesign and the update is still in progress, so please bear with us. You may want to clear your browser's cache and cookies for this site. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Also, we invite you to post feedback in this topic: http://www.205gtidrivers.com/topic/171489-new-website-feeback/ 

  • Welcome to 205GTIDrivers.com!

    Hello dear visitor! Feel free to browse but we invite you to register completely free of charge in order to enjoy the full functionality of the website.

Andy

[Car_Upgrade] Yet Another Mi16 1.9 Build

Recommended Posts

Andy

I know this story has been told before. In fact I have thoroughly enjoyed reading other people's builds and learned from what they have done. I am not going to start with a pictorial record of the strip, suffice to say that the car was a Graphite 1.9 Gti , K reg ( but not a Cat version remarkably ) . The shell was in good condition , which is more than could be said for the rest of the car. I bought it in January 2015 and trailered it back from Bedford to my rented home in South Derbyshire. There I did a rather rushed strip and mechanical rebuild to get the car back on the road . The haste was simply because we were planning to move to our permanent home in Ashbourne later in the year, and our new home had a much smaller garage then the one that came with the rented cottage.

Anyway, move went as planned last November so, after Christmas , I decided to do the job properly and strip the car to a bare shell , rebuild/ upgrade everything and then piece it all back together again.

What could possibly go wrong? Well, the roof for one. During the paint and underseal stripping process which was carried out by a third party, the roof suffered some damage. Enter stage right a good roof from a poor unsuspecting base 205. The 'new' roof is now attached and I will upload a photograph or two as soon as I have taken them.

As for the mechanical side, I had carefully rebuilt a 1.9 engine with a mild increase in c.r and a Kent cam plus vernier cam wheel. The plan was, until a month ago, to use this along with a K6 Emerald and a set of 45 Jenvey bodies. The change is an upgrade to the 1,9 16v engine which I bought from a fellow forum member a couple of weeks ago. A few attached pictures show the engine at its worst, that is partially stripped and looking really scruffy, which is a bit unfair as internally it is in pretty good shape and has a pair of Petert solid lifters cams and vernier cam wheels.

I will detail this engine rebuild as it develops along with something that seldom appears on these build threads, the cost!

The gearbox is already completed and sitting under the workbench. I have used 1st to fourth from a 1.9 , final drive from a 1.6 and fifth stolen from 6th gear from a gti6 box.

I hope the above introduction makes some kind of sense. I will try to update as I make progress.

Andypost-26334-0-48617800-1475953846.jpgpost-26334-0-60363300-1475953859.jpgpost-26334-0-41990200-1475953873.jpgpost-26334-0-62520100-1475953888.jpgpost-26334-0-51887300-1475953903.jpgpost-26334-0-59078600-1475953924_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-60380800-1475953945_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

post-26334-0-31923800-1475956398_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-23622200-1475956414_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-21922900-1475956429_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-09847800-1475956477_thumb.jpg

A few more engine photos including the mains and big end shells

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
petert

I'm trying to work out the sump. Is there a wall in there?

 

You could re-use the mains bearings but throw the others in the bin.

Edited by petert

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Morning,

Yes, the sump has a baffle, which is handy. I will start again with all new bearings as a matter of course. The crank is away being checked, balanced etc prior to me doing any cleaning and prep work. I hope that it will not need agrind but have left that decision to the engineering company who's judgement I trustpost-26334-0-09752300-1475994932_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-01206300-1475994947_thumb.jpg

Couple more photos showing the head prior to stripping

 

(Why are some photos appearing upside down!!!????)

Edited by Andy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
petert

My iphone is doing that at the moment too. I have to use an editor to flip them around.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Thank you. Noted. I will check my next post and edit accordingly

Andy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Thank you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TAG

I'll be stripping and at least partially rebuilding an mi in the near future, so I'll be watching this with interest

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

I will try to add as much detail as I can. Currently most of what I am doing is cleaning parts and/ or ferrying them to the engineering company for work to be done or ordering new parts.

I said I would include costs, so here goes so far,

New Westwood Mi16 liners. £440

New 52 link chain for the oil pump, 26t sprocket and 6 bar spring £52 ( although I may end up not using the sprocket and chain)

Though not bought yet, waterpump, complete Paynen gasket set, shells and thrusts, seals, rings , Gates cam belt kit with tensioner, comes in at £520

Full rotating and reciprocating parts balance...... not quite sure but at least £200

New valves guides and seat recut.... at least £100 and probably more

Aqua blasting £100

Plating of all nuts and bolts. £40

Other cylinder head components , including springs, spring seats, spring caps etc. Not sure yet but will be significant

Sundries, like Jizer, plastic boxes by the dozen, oil, cam lube various versions of Locktite.... say £100 ( l know, but Jizer is nearly £25 for a five litre can)

I already have an Emerald K6 and a set of Jenvey bodies, and all I need to build a new loom, but I will need some trumpets, backing plate and air filter or air box. That will be another couple of hundred at least

Injectors. £240

 

 

So, adding up, and I am sure I have not accounted for everything, though I am keeping a careful record and all the receipts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
petert

I've never had to put complete new guides in an Mi16 head. K-lines have always been sufficient.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shane17

Nice build Andy, I'm jealous that youve gone full nut and bolt on the chassis I would to do this but time isn't on my side but FairPlay.

 

What's the plan for the Pistons and rods?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Rods and pistons are standard and in excellent condition. I know that going to forged pistons and steel rods would give lots of development potential, but rods from Arrows or Cunninghams are the quality product and, along with CP pistons, the price tag would skyrocket and is, frankly, more than I want to spend, particularly given how much I spent on the rest of the car so far!!!

As for the guides Peter, the exhausts are o.e and in good shape, though I do need to measure them carefully. The inlets have been replaced and are in poor condition. K line inserts are an option. O.e guides are £4 each, Spoox phosphor bronze are around £8 each and K line around the same price. So, another chat with the engineering company on this on

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

4 hours of paint stripping, scrubbing and sanding. Almost ready for a coat of etch primer nowpost-26334-0-23179400-1476272389_thumb.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
welshpug

o.e guides are bronze iirc so can't see why (other than their usual pricing) the spooox valve guides would be twice the price

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Thank you. I assumed the standard ones were cast iron and when I made a call to a supplier they did not disagree. For oil retention, phosphor bronze followed by a suitable flexihone allows one to run much closer valve to guide clearance so I am keen on PB if possible, although K-line may well fix all the problems in one go

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
petert

Depends on the overall fitted price really. If OEM is cheaper, I'd use them in preference to K-lines. It doesn't matter in your case, but you wouldn't use a K-line on a turbo/supercharged exhaust valve. Otherwise fine on inlets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shane17

I've been doing more reading up on the oil surge / starvation issue for these engines. Obviously mixed opinions and no definitive solution but what will you be doing other than the baffled sump out of interest? I've spotted that you may not use the sprocket and chain, also is this build for fast road or track?

 

I've re read the post regarding oil ways in the cranks and someone mentioned about an external oil drain from the head to mitigate retention but was wondering what your thoughts are on this as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Afternoon,

Primarily a road car but I will be tempted by the odd track day, but still mostly the former. Definitely a baffled sump. On my last car I used an Accusump with an electrically controlled valve which meant that on start up, the Accusump fed its contents at 60+ psi directly to the crank before the engine began to turn over and, if on a spirited drive, I overrode the valve with a bypass switch on the dash to combat surge. This is certainly one option. The snag is space in the engine bay to locate the Accusump as the container is a couple of litres. As for the 26 tooth sprocket, I was all set to do this until PeterT showed some photographs of a failed 26 tooth sprocket, which has left me in serious doubt about the modification. I do not know of others experience in this area. As for oil retention in the head, I confess that I regard this as less of a problem. As long as there is sufficient oil in the system to have a sump at the correct level , I am not sure I am too worried about an extra litre of oil in the head. Running an Accusump automatically puts a potential extra 1.5 litres of oil in the system if, all of a sudden, there was a significant oil pressure drop. I do plan to use the PeterT oil restrictors in the head to limit the rate at which oil is supplied to the head in the first place, so that might be enough to balance the drain rate back to the sump.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Hi Peter'

Yes, I need to get a price from the machine shop for the valve guide work. I looked up the Kline inserts. Very cost effective as long as one has all the right tools. If not, a pricey job to do oneself. I will drive over and discuss this with them when I have the head back next week

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Cam box cover with a few coats of paint. Just the clear lacquer to go.post-26334-0-72983200-1476633820_thumb.jpg

post-26334-0-75816400-1476633845_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

A bit cleaner than they were a week ago. Now the work starts!post-26334-0-43658900-1476729124_thumb.jpgpost-26334-0-89984800-1476729142.jpgpost-26334-0-53960500-1476729162.jpgpost-26334-0-20385100-1476729175.jpgpost-26334-0-48125100-1476729191_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shane17

That looks awesome, have they been vapour blasted?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
petert

That piece of aluminium welded into the sump won't do anything meaningful. There are far better options available.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Andy

Aquablasted, which takes a lot of the pain of initial cleaning away, but there is still lots of prep and cleaning to do before anything can go back together. As for the sump Peter, I agree. That piece of Aluminium will do very little to,prevent the oil pump from drawing some fresh air under hard cornering. Having used an Accusump before, it is one option, but it is not a cheap one. I have seen baffled sump kits available but would welcome any recommendation . Having spent a significant sum of money rebuilding this engine, I don't want it to self destruct the first time I venture out onto a track ( I am sure it will be fine as it is for the road)

Oh, by the way Peter, springs ordered from Catcams via ' ATspeedracing' , who were very helpful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×