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decoc182

1.4 16v Can It Be Done Easily?

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decoc182

I was just wondering if it would be possible to mate a TU5J4 or TU5JP4 onto a TU3 bottom end. Have any combinations been tried? Ive thought of using the TU3S or TU3FJ (gti) bottom end with 16V head (TU5J4 or TU5JP4), inlet, exhaust,TB and loom.

 

I have had a good look around, but cant really find any answers that show an easy build.

 

Any help much appreciated.

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EdCherry

Why not take the 1.4 16v out of the 206?

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swordfish210
Why not take the 1.4 16v out of the 206?

 

Isn't that an iron block. I know that Sandy's done at least one 16v 1.4, not sure about any of the parts that he used though.

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EdCherry

Thought it was ally personally, has VVT and some other gubbins so its not that bad of an engine.

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dcc

arent there 1.4 16v's found in peugeot 106s

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BackStreetRacecars

it does work. I have test built a alloy block 1360 motor with a 16v head.... cant rememeber what I found tho.... probably need costom pistons... For valve cutouts and compression issues... Was very light tho. could pci kthe whole thing up in my arms... hilarious so it was!!

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burr_2000

I know a guy called Gary Muir who is running a 1.4 16v in a pug 106 and its rapid (heavily tuned). Basically he took a 1.6 engine and changed it to 1.4 by altering stroke etc (dont ask me how :) ) so he can run in 1400 class.

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decoc182

ahh kk.,

 

Thought it was as simple as bolting on and matching CR perhaps. Not as DIY as i thought

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BackStreetRacecars
I know a guy called Gary Muir who is running a 1.4 16v in a pug 106 and its rapid (heavily tuned). Basically he took a 1.6 engine and changed it to 1.4 by altering stroke etc (dont ask me how :) ) so he can run in 1400 class.

 

 

Would have thought... of course for racing regs the capacity has to sorted... but.... have you felt the weight of an iron block tu?? at least compared to the alloy one?

 

decoc.... get the bits and try it.... best way to find out.well thats my advice, and if you can't get it all together.... save and get the custom pistons or whatever hurdle it is.... then do it!!! afaik a certain sout scotland based tuning company does something very similar for 5 grand..... for something similar i'm if you collect bits that you could maybe all source from breakers, on here or ebay and build it yourself...... worth doing..... do it!!!

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Sandy

Not as easy as it sounds and Garry bought the car with the engine in it by the way. The 1.4 16v alloy engine (ET3J4) used in the 206 etc, is pap. The valvetrain is unnecessarily complex and weak, it's not designed with tuning in mind and will limit the potential.

 

The main problems with building a TU3J4, are the bore and CR. Really you need a minimum of 78mm bore to suit the head chamber and the size of the chamber means fairly sizeable intruders are needed. Many have been built for rallying, most of which claim around 185bhp, but seem to be a bit peaky and inflexible compared to similarly powered 14XEs (John Read's best are over 200bhp, but pull cleanly from 2000rpm!). I built one a couple years back that made 174bhp (at 8500rpm) and was pretty flexible; I've just finished rebuilding it with revised cams, inlet manifold, exhaust manifold, head and piston crowns, hopefully making more and with further flexibility! I'll post some info when it's been set up and I know how well it worked.

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burr_2000

 

 

This is a video of the 1.4 16v engine. He recently had problems with it (bent all valve and knackered piston). The cost to do this is stupid and really only worth it if your looking for a class winning car (thats different). I was suprised you are allowed to modify original higher cc cars to enter lower cc classes and then you start to wonder what people are actually running under there bonnets.

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Sandy

Quite, I found out from an ex employee of a company that used to prepare quite a few TU3J4 engines, that they were all around 1430cc, the customers had no idea they were over the class limit!

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205Rallee

For most road going hillclimb and sprint classes you need to use the original head and block so you can't stick a 106 rallye 1294cc engine in a 205 and you certainly can't stick a 16v 1.4 in a 106 or 205....

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SPGTi

martin Bowyer has built quite a few 1.4 16v engines that are running in some front running 106's and C2's in the BRC and BRTDA. These are definitely 1.4 or below as my friends was checked by the scrutineers because he was so much faster than the rest of the class

 

Steve

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Sandy

Just to be clear, it wasn't Bowyer!

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Mattsav

Gary's engnes was originally built by Bowyer. Big cams and std valves sizes.

 

I did a big valve head & tamer cams and it made + 2bhp but actually had a mid range. Unfortunatley the oil pump chain let go which killed it :lol:

 

The TU3J4 engine can be made to work but its a lot more expensive to do (steel billet cams required as its a roller rocker engine) and you limited by the valve size.

 

The basic ingredients for a cheap build are an 1100cc crank, Kit car rods, 80mm pistons & the head & cams to suit the rpm you need. Obviously its not cheap but the parts are available off the shelf which makes life much easier.

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Sandy

The alloy block 1.4 16v engine code is ET3J4. By TU3J4 I meant a 1.4 version of the TU5J4.

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pug205rally
martin Bowyer has built quite a few 1.4 16v engines that are running in some front running 106's and C2's in the BRC and BRTDA. These are definitely 1.4 or below as my friends was checked by the scrutineers because he was so much faster than the rest of the class

 

Steve

The best one of these I've ever seen was pedalled by Nick Ebsworth 190BHP and reliable and Nick won a couple of Single Venue events outright as I recall including putting a number of much more powerful cars to shame , EVO , Scoobie and 6R4 - even made a double page spread in Motoring news at the time. Just to make the package fly the engine was mated to a Sadev box

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tony perks
The best one of these I've ever seen was pedalled by Nick Ebsworth 190BHP and reliable and Nick won a couple of Single Venue events outright as I recall including putting a number of much more powerful cars to shame , EVO , Scoobie and 6R4 - even made a double page spread in Motoring news at the time. Just to make the package fly the engine was mated to a Sadev box

 

 

Looks like the car in the video above is nicks old car, I'm sure he said it went to scotland.

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EdCherry

Well I can safely say that the 1.4 16v isnt a slow car. Went out at combe in it on the action day as a passenger and yer it was a laugh!

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burr_2000

I think when gary bought it he thought it was gonna be pruducing 200bhp but when he RR it only produced about 167bhp respectively.

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NEMCA

Casting up an old thread here. Has anyone else built one of these?

 

I've just finished building one using standard off the shelf parts, 1100 crank, standard TU5J4 rods and pistons (rebored) from another manufacturer with the correct crown height! So it is possible on a budget.

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welshpug

sandy has built one or two since, not sure you'll find a full spec as they are race engines, most likely custom steel rods and forged pistons to his spec.

 

not as expensive as you might think.

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NEMCA

Its expensive enough. I priced rods and pistons and it was pricey so i resorted to option B as i knew there must be a cheaper way to do it.

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dcc

Neil

 

Be interested in hearing whats the full spec and what you managed to extract power wise :)

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